The Full Story of MKBHD

All right, welcome to my first video. Bought a new laptop. The world's greatest gadget reviewer. I didn't even know such a thing existed. So yeah, welcome to video number 100. He is, in my opinion, the tech reviewer on the YouTube platform, and really for me just in general. This is the first video I'm uploading to over a million subscribers on YouTube. Kind of a ridiculous number. Oh, what? Thanks Marques. Marques Brownlee. And the creator of the decade award goes to MKBHD. Rest. Recording. Rolling. Perfect. So the first thing we wanted to ask you is around the fact that we've heard you say multiple times that you say no to 99.9999% of things that come through your inbox. We're curious. This is the first time that we're speaking in person. Why say yes to do this? Well, okay. Long time listener. First time speaking to you guys. I've watched your videos for a while. I've watched the show. I see the podcast. Of course, I'd like to talk with you guys. Of course, I know this is going to be a fun chat. So of course I said yes. That's really cool. It's awesome to know. I mean, Colin just said first time talking to you in person, but we're actually talking virtually and digitally. And I think what's amazing in the creator community is just that you feel like you do, if you do watch someone's channel, develop a relationship with them. It's kind of confusing. It's like, wait, do we know each other or do we not know each other? We've never spoken, but we both know a lot about each other. Yeah. Cool. Well, yeah, it seems like you have a lot going on right now. Just curious, like what is happening in the world of MKBHD? What does it look like right now? Like, are you on a bit of a press tour? Is this MKBHD 2.0? No, it's funny though. Anytime it seems like I'll do something online and then there will be like a ripple effect of equal opportunities where I'll do a podcast and then everyone with the podcast goes, we should have them on a podcast. No, my world is in this like sort of lull in the year where there's not too much tech happening. So I have a lot of time to reflect and reinvest to make this year better than last year. Obviously, the world of MKBHD has grown into a bigger media property than when this all first started. So we do want to just rewind for a second. And I was watching some of the videos of you uploading your golf swing as some of your first pieces of content on YouTube. I was just curious at that time when you were uploading your golf swing looking for feedback, were you watching YouTube at that time? Were you inspired by other creators or were you just looking at it as a platform to upload your golf swing? No, absolutely. My uploads were 100% inspired by watching lots of videos. It was pretty obvious to me at the time that there was a sort of community effect where you could talk to people from around the world who didn't know you, who would descend upon your video because of search and leave a comment. It felt like pretty special at the time and still like it's a ton of fun now. Even now it's like amplified. I'll pour my heart and soul into something and spend hours and hours and hours on it. And the second it's done uploading and I hit publish, thousands of people will have the ability to watch and react to what I just made. And that cycle just keeps getting better and better. So was there a specific creator that you did watch that kind of tipped your mind into the aspiration of taking on YouTube as a career? Or was there anyone that you looked at and you were like, hey, maybe it's not necessarily just a hobby and this could be a thing that I do? Yeah, there were some early tech creative YouTubers that paved the way. I think one of the, probably the earliest one would be Chris Pirillo, aka Locker Gnome was his channel. And he was live streaming all the time. He made YouTube videos. And that might've been the first like professional tech social media thing I ever saw. And then there were others. There was the iJustines, the Soldier Knows Best, the John for Lakers of the world, sort of in this like initial wave of people making consistent high quality tech videos that made me really fascinated by it and made me want to do the same thing. So there were a few, definitely like people paving the way before me for sure. And when you went to college then, yeah, I know you talked about, you studied business in college. Was there, as you were in college making videos, your audience is growing, were you thinking about your channel as like a case study? Or, hey, these lessons I'm learning in business school actually could be applied here to what I'm doing on YouTube? Yeah, not only did I look at my channel as a case study, I had professors look at me and my channel as a case study, which is funny. That's cool. I did have a professor go, why haven't you dropped out? Like literally asked me why I didn't drop out during my junior year, which I thought was strange. But I think at that point it was somewhere one to 2 million subscribers. And I was just barely beginning to work with brands. And by the time I was, you know, two, three, four years into college, it became obvious at some point in those years that that would be what I did when I graduated. A lot of times the business school people do a co-op or they'll do an internship in the middle of their career because they know they want to work for something in that industry. I never did any of them. And that to me was like, because I was putting that fuel back into my own channel. Was there a moment throughout your rise? Because your rise has been very steady, but also significant. And there are certain moments, like marquee interviews that I look at, whether it's like Kobe Bryant, or, you know, recently President Obama. I'm curious to know which of these moments for you was sort of a, whoa, this is crazy. And like, same for your family. Oh, interesting. So for me, definitely Kobe, 100%. That's the most nervous I've ever been to interview anyone. Most nervous, probably the most nervous I've ever been. So the first time my contact on Nike ever reached out, he's like, would you like to interview Kobe? We've got his new shoes coming out. It's in the middle of his farewell tour season. He's got a huge hand in designing these shoes and the tech in them. We think it would be a cool collab. Yes, of course. Yes, I'll definitely want to do this. And so the way it's kind of set up is it's in this gym of like, he's going to come into the gym and he's going to go around the gym and sit down for each interview one by one. So I'm like, he walks in and then he sits down for the first interview and I can see his like entourage surround the interview. So I can't see the interview, but I see that it's happening over there. And then he moves to the next one and then he moves to the next one. So the hype is like building like exponentially as I wait to like, hopefully not forget the questions that I've been trying to memorize for the past hour. He comes over, he's super nice and we immediately just start talking. Like the interview goes great. And I think, yeah, that everything that's surrounded that once it's published and then like the sort of sit back and like, okay, yeah, that did just happen. I did just interview Kobe for a video. That's real. That I felt like opens a lot of doors in my own head. It opens a lot of doors in other people, possible collaborators heads. And I think to my family, it was probably pretty surprising because I don't really tell them about things until they're like either about to launch or launching. I feel like I don't want to jinx anything, but once that video goes up, they're like, I'm sorry, what? You did what? So yeah, there's a lot of, I think that was definitely, I think I'd put that at the top of my list of like peak channel interview moments. I think that's pretty much it. Thanks for being a part of this. I appreciate the time and hopefully we'll get to do it again. Thank you. Like those moments, obviously they're like big moments for you, for your family, for the brand, but I actually think they're those moments. And I specifically remember the Kobe interview being a very big moment to help validate myself and us as creators. When someone within the creator ecosystem gets to do something like that, like I think it actually raises just the bar and elevates just what it means to be a creator and how powerful uploading to YouTube and building an audience is. Yeah, I think I feel that too. And I feel grateful to be able to open some of those doors. Sometimes it could feel almost, I don't know if a glass ceiling is the right word, but like there was sort of a peak of like what you can do as a creator, things you can unlock, if you will. And I feel like when another one of those doors gets opened by one creator, it feels like it opens for a lot of other creators and similar types of doors will open because if it goes well enough, they'll want to do something like that also. So yeah, I feel like that's been a pretty nice by-product for sure. Was there another creator that you saw that felt opened the door, that kind of opened your mind to what was possible? Like I would say for us, obviously watching Casey turn his everyday life into engaging content, unlocked this world in my head. I went to film school and understanding like, hey, here's this guy who's turning his everyday life into movies. Was this like incredible moment of empowerment for me as a creator? So I'm just curious, was there like the Marques Brownlee, Kobe Bryant interview, was there a video like that for you? I don't know if there is a single thing like that. I think what came to mind is on the style actually, because if you look back at like the early videos, they were very simple. They were shot on like a webcam or maybe like a Sanyo Zakti hand cam, whatever. Watching, especially so John Morris in TLD Today, another tech creator, was one of the first to start doing videos on DSLRs and like to start really playing with cinematography and videos, sliders, moving shots and things like that. And that was one of the earliest moments where I was like, oh wait, I kind of love cameras. Why don't I just go all out with like the production and the gear too? And that turned out to be a ton of fun. So I want to give like him a shout out for that because like tech videos didn't look like the way they do now before that early moment of us sort of starting to experiment with that. So I think now the production ceiling is much higher. Yeah, definitely. What about creators in the current moment? Are there certain people on the platform that you look at and the way that they treat their business and the way that maybe they're pioneering what it means to be a creator? Are there creators like that that you're watching, you're taking notes from? Yeah, I think MrBeast is sort of the obvious answer right now, just as far as business ventures. We've talked a lot about this, but just like how to focus a team on building something that you're building, get everybody on the same page and building towards the same thing. So I think that would be the obvious answer is like how can you not respect like not only the depth of like the videos that he makes and how far he goes to make each video, but to see the process a little bit behind the scenes. I feel like even David Dobrik, a little bit of the same thing where you see him at an event and he'll have his camera and it'll be this, I remember this pretty specifically, saw him at the Cybertruck event and he was just kind of hanging out and the Cybertruck goes on stage and it's just this crazy thing. And I'm there to make an entire video about the Cybertruck. And I remember like watching his vlog like a couple days later, whenever the next one was and there wasn't a single second of footage from that because it just wasn't good enough. And like that to me, that level of dedication to that craft, which is like collecting all the best moments was inspiring too. So I'll toss some love to Dobrik and MrBeast. So you've described being a YouTuber as being an octopus where you have eight different arms that all represent different parts of the business. At what point do you chop off one of your octopus arms and hand it to someone else? Like when did that happen? Yeah, I've always had the idea. I think back in, I mean, maybe when I was in college, you know, there's people telling you, hire an editor, hire an editor, hire an editor. That was like the thing to do, hire an editor. And I was like, oh, okay. So if I hire an editor, then I can be like shooting videos and then passing them all the footage. And then while they're editing, I can be working on the next one. That's genius. That's twice as much output. That's so useful. So like that was the first mission. All right, I'm gonna find an editor. And you know, it didn't really have much success with that. But I think what I realized is another part of that octopus analogy, which is some parts of the MKBHD creative process are like one of the hearts are like not really something that I feel that I can chop off. So the team now is five and it is me, Andrew, Vin, Brandon, Michael. And they're all really good at the things that I was like doing with other arms, like the set design and cinematography and motion graphics and management and things like and sort of pass off to be done way better than if I was doing all of it. And I think the last hardest pieces are the creative pieces, like writing, like camera work, and like editing. And so those are a much longer, more deliberate process. But I think eventually those will end up also chopped off. We'll see. Writing is the interesting one I want to ask you about, because I read somewhere that you mentioned you took to video because you were never much of a writer. But it's clear if you look at your videos, there's some serious writing that goes in to your videos. So what is your trajectory, your path look like as a writer? And how does writing fit into your process? I feel like writing has become the most inefficient use of my time. It's the thing that I spend the most time on in this job that I have, which is making tech videos. So I'm testing products. I'm putting together all my notes. I'm writing them all down. I'm making the video. I'm editing the video. That writing process or putting together a video takes like an entire day when the rest of the post-production process also only takes one day. All the editing, all the shooting, all the design, all the motion graphics, everything. I was always a pretty mathy person, but now I feel like I'm a professional writer at this point, which is crazy. So yeah, writing is one of the most interesting new hires that we have happening this year. And I'm really excited about who we have joining the team. And I think not just making review videos, but another thing about tech is videos have a very short tail, which basically is like, how long are you going to watch the iPhone 12 review after it comes out? Maybe about another year and then that's it. But making those more interesting explainers and those long tail evergreen videos, 5G explained, talking about why companies do certain things. Those are the types of videos I want to be doing more of. And so to be able to do those in between the reviews and have someone helping with writing and research on those things is that's exciting to me. I think that'll be pretty big. So what does the MKBHD org chart kind of look like? And how does an idea go from, you know, hey, here's an idea and what is like the process of getting it into, okay, now it's going to be made into a video and now we're publishing. At this point, it'll depend on the video, but let's say it's a review because that's like the bread and butter. So the device will show up. I will do all my testing and everything. The review process begins basically with me writing all the things down that are going to go into the video. I have a Google doc that I start adding all of my thoughts to that will slowly morph into a script, kind of like baking a cake, but you can see it being baked. So I share this document with everyone here with Andrew, who's sort of like production manager and Vin and Brandon are cinematographers. So as I finish writing, they can see this pie baking as like a shot list and go through and get some of the B-roll of, oh, he talks about the speakers. So let's get some shots of the speakers and let's get some shots of the cameras and the general device. We'll get a spec shot. We'll set up some top downs, things like that. Stuff that I would ordinarily also have to spend time doing later. And then once the writing is done, then we basically set up the talking to camera part and then fill in the blanks basically within the edit. So I'll talk about a whole bunch of stuff. We'll shoot me using the phone. I'll shoot me using the phone and then we'll just sort of hammer out any sort of fun last details, which might be an intro or an outro or some crazy robot shot or top downs or whatever it is. It all comes together in the edit, which is just me sitting in front of the computer for a few hours till my eyes bleed. And then that's it. Then it goes up to YouTube and it's published. Do you feel like you sitting there editing until your eyes bleed is essential? Like, is that a irreplaceable component of the process? Up till this point, it has felt like it, but I know deep down that it's not. And I think finding and hiring not just talented editors, but talented editors who are familiar with YouTube and are familiar with the tech world and are familiar with reviews who can edit a review to the certain style that I would could make an MKBHD video. I just think I want to make MKBHD videos. Does that make sense? I feel like the little things that I find in the edit that I can like twist or like bend a little bit to make a video work the way I want really happens in those critical couple hours where I'm like obsessing over the edit. And I don't know that I can teach that. Is there someone who helps though, like maybe loads in the footage, chops it down to selects and then you take it or you take in just the, you shoot and you take in the raw footage and it's yours? I take all the footage in, we shoot on RED cameras, so these little SSDs and they go shoot like for B-roll for a while. They'll just drop off a mag at my desk and just go shoot some more stuff. So I'll have like a stack of mags and I'll import all the footage. So I take it from raw footage to final product. What about the intricacies of like when you push in from whatever it is, like 4K and you push in or 8K and you do a slight push in, are you making that move? Yep, yeah. A lot of, some of that is with software, some of that is the way we designed it in the shot. The stuff that I'll pass off is like the crazy intricate, a lot of times intro shots and videos. So you might see like the first five seconds of the video is some crazy like drop down helio shot of like revealing the phone from behind something with some motion track text. That will be lifted and passed off. Then Brandon and Michael, who are really good with that, can take it from there. They'll have my direction on like what to make and then that will get dropped in at the beginning or wherever it fits into what I was building. But yeah, other than that, soup to nuts is in my hands. It's also not an easy thing for most creators that we talk to. Hiring is not an easy thing to do, especially because you're a solo creator. You've been making this stuff on your own. The easiest way to do it is just, hey, let me just grab a camera, shoot it and edit it. So I'm just curious how, like what makes a good MKBHD hire and how do you think about hiring as you start to scale into new ventures? As I build the team this year, especially I'm looking at not just skills. We kind of call them unicorns, but people who share the taste and the ability to turn the taste into reality. So a lot of times I'll like describe a shot or describe an intro and we can sort of get the wheels turning in everyone's head to the point where we know roughly what we're making and we don't have to do a whole bunch of back and forth. And a good hire is someone who is good at executing on those ideas basically. And now if it's a writer that just comes with like learning the language of a video that I make and adapting to that, if it's in cinematography or if it's in editing, that's just gonna come with me teaching that style, which makes it feel like my job is going from writer to teacher. And that was actually part of my follow-up question was about education. There's not really like a track right now, not only to become a YouTube creator, but an educational track that's like prepares you to work with a YouTube creator. Do you think that there's something, whether it's looking back at your education that really helped or advice that you would give to someone who's interested in working for a creator? When I describe these people as unicorns, it's like anytime you find someone who is that good at that many different things, they're usually already their own independent creator in some way, probably already a YouTuber. And if they're not, they have the skills to be because they have writing, they have the ability to turn their taste into a vision and turn it into a video and they know audio and sound design, all this stuff. So the advice I would give really is to be multifaceted, to not just be a great editor because a lot of people can be great editors, but to be a great editor that also knows how to do X, Y, and Z and how to bring those things into an edit or how to enhance an edit using unusual skills from other areas. Same thing might apply to writing or cameraman type stuff. But I think, yeah, the advice would be to be multi-skilled, multi-talented, sharpen multiple knives, I would say. Could you describe how one of your employees came to work at your company? I know I think Michael had a form of cold outreach to you, correct? Yes, it was incredible. So he's our motion graphics specialist, right? So if you see like motion tracking animations or text or things like that, intros in the videos, he's responsible for most of those. His cold email was literally like, hey, every year it seems like you redo your graphics on your channel, like your intro, your outro. Are you gonna do on this year? I think this is at the beginning of 2018 or something like that. And I was like, oh yeah, cause he had his portfolio when he did motion graphics too. And so the last time I'd redone my intro, I'd worked with this spectacularly talented artist who'd done commercial work and we went back and forth for like a month on this amazing thing, this amazing five second thing that became the intro. And Michael said, all right, I like that idea. And recreated that intro from scratch from his own assets and said, now what would you change? And as soon as I saw that, I was like, okay, this guy's good. This guy's good. He's clearly a million times more talented at me and that one After Effects class I took in college. So yeah, it was a no brainer to, and the fact that he could execute on the changes and had the taste and had the timing, that was incredible. So if you can do that, if that can be your cold email, do it. Definitely do it. Are you hiring anyone to sort of oversee everything that's happening with MKBHD? Sort of a chief of staff or a manager, someone that is keeping their eye on every facet of the business? I should, shouldn't I? That is one of our, I have an idea board and we have some potential hires to look for in the next few weeks and months. And that is one of them, just because as the team grows and things get more complex and we're working on more simultaneous projects. Actually up until this point, we hadn't used any project management software at all. They would just be our Google doc and whatever notes I was taking and sort of reminding people what we're doing at any given time and then the podcast and then the emails there. We just sort of keep it all on mind and new hire came and said, so, okay, great. What project management software do you guys use? And we didn't have an answer because we didn't use any. So that has been actually a really great addition, being able to put everything down in text and to have everyone be able to see all the goals and all the projects at once. And I think as things continue to build and get more complex and creative, we will probably need to have someone who literally just oversees everything to make sure that's not my new primary job. Yeah, I have this interesting visual when I think about creators and even our experience, we built a few different businesses on YouTube. And typically as the creators, when you think about hiring, you're thinking, okay, let me hire people to support what I'm doing. And then you kind of remain at the top of the organization. Everything flows up to you. But in this next iteration of where we're headed, what we've started to look at is, actually, I think we're in the center of the organization and we actually could hire above us. Meaning people who are there to oversee the overarching org and everything that's happening, they still work for us, but they're actually operating at a more managerial or C-level perspective, taking a look at the business as a whole. And that's a new way of thinking that we've adopted recently. And something that I think requires a little bit of letting go of certain elements of the business, especially if you want to really lean into the creative side of it, letting go a little bit on the business side. And so I know that, yeah, I want to hear from you about the business side of MKBHD. And I know that you still do negotiate some of your deals. And I'm curious about how much of your time goes into that side. Yeah, that is a lot of my time. So a couple things there. One is, I think in a dream world, if I can cut off all the right arms, my primary job will be content strategy. Right. Because that's what I think I can contribute to this org in the tech world on YouTube, basically. I'm still reviewing. I'm still using things. I'm still trying to figure out what's good and what's not. But that, I think, will be the primary time thing. The other thing is, yes, so what you mentioned is being in the middle of the org instead of at the top. A lot of what we've already written down in this idea board is things that that person would do. And we noticed that a lot of the things that we were writing were like, tell me what the sponsor deliverables are so that I can make sure I do them. Like, make sure you remind me to do things so that I can deliver to those things. So yeah, it does feel like you want to be more in the center with all these things happening around you. When you're like the hub of the wheel, maybe something like that. And yeah, the business. So I do, yeah, I'm in the inbox a lot. That's another thing. So I am negotiating the deals, who to work with, who not to. I'm typing no 99.99% of the time. But that does feel like pretty integral as a piece of how people identify the MKBHD brand is the selectiveness of who we work with and what we do decide to work with brands on. So yeah, all that still applies. That's pretty amazing. But you do have an agency in WME that supports, are they involved in the negotiation? Or you're passing, once you decide on the brand, you're letting them take care of the agreement. And at what point did it make sense to bring in a partner like that in WME? This was probably about four or five years ago that we started working with them. And so I do, and they will bring in some brands specifically on projects interested in working with me. But it feels like half of them come through WME and half of them come directly to me, which is fine. It just means I'm like literally reading contracts, which is not fun, but I'll work with brands directly. But it did make sense once that value became obvious. And also because if you're relying entirely on AdSense, obviously that's not as stable. So this was when I was graduating from college and turning it into a job that it made a lot of sense to try to focus on picking the right brand deals and doing those well. When you look at potentially trying to diversify your revenue streams, realizing that you do lean heavily on AdSense, lean heavily on brand sponsorships, what's the next category that you're really looking at building now? So as much as we are continuing to build out the media channels, products are the next most obvious thing. Considering that seems like people agree with a lot of my taste in products, it would be wise to capitalize on and curate or create some type of products for people who have the same taste as me. So that's that sort of natural transition. Hey, there you go. Got the icon skin, got the mask. So yeah, so that's what I'm talking about is like, if we can make stuff that we like, then hopefully other people will like it too. That thought of diversifying as you're talking about new products, is there any like consulting with tech companies? You mentioned that it seems like there's people who enjoy your taste. And I think in your S21 video, you were like, there might be some people over there who are watching MKBHD. Is there a level of interaction with any of the companies who are interested in consulting and having you actually work on the products? Yeah, up until now, zero. I've never consulted for any tech company that makes anything. They ask all the time. But to some level, giving free advice to a company whose product I reviewed doesn't quite feel right. And so I haven't, but I'm definitely exploring those opportunities because there's got to be some way because like everyone, if you want me to make a tech product, I don't have the means by myself here in my video studio to make one. So I have to partner with or use the resources of some tech company in some way. But the path to that happening hasn't been as clear. Like we've made the dbrand icon skins and those are accessories for phones, but I don't review skins or cases. So we're still playing with that. Is that like a dream of yours to have a MKBHD edition phone or your own line of actual true hardware tech? Something like that, yeah. Definitely having my own line of something that I make and that is a representation of my taste in some field would be pretty sweet. In your Dogecoin video, you said that having a diverse investment portfolio is a good strategy. Also, a quick note on that Dogecoin video, your like turns to camera where you were giving the disclaimers that were clearly shot after, but they were so seamless. Those were really good. That was really, I really liked that. But I'm curious, when you look at like a diverse strategy, of course, like in the business, you have different revenue streams, but now you're starting to launch multiple channels. You're thinking about new media properties. Do you feel like it makes sense to be diversified across social platforms as a creator or diversified across formats and channels within one social platform? So a little bit of both, especially on YouTube, our plan is to be diversified across YouTube. So we're launching channels and we're tweaking things in that way. But I do think being diversified across different platforms helps you with leverage both for yourself against a platform and just to capitalize on different audiences. I didn't realize how little of an overlap there is between like people watching videos on YouTube and people watching the same videos on Facebook, for example. So my stance on repurposing content had always been super negative. I hated when someone would like upload the same thing to Instagram and then to Twitter and then to Facebook because it was like, why am I following you on all these things? But it turns out most people don't do that. So I think taking advantage of that platform's native tools and specifically creating for that platform. Like I see people upload videos to TikTok but that they're just cut from a YouTube video. It's fine, it works. But like if you make a TikTok that's gonna be better every time. So I think taking advantage of the platform natively is the best way to go about that. But you should diversify across platforms for sure. For us, it was actually really surprising to hear I think around 40 or 35% of your revenue comes from AdSense. And I think that's so amazing that YouTube can actually pay out creators in that style. You mentioned that there's a big chunk around 50 to 60% on brand deals, is that right? Yeah, something like that, probably 60, yeah. And then a bit on merch. I'm curious, I know you've referred like almost over 400 Teslas. Is there like an affiliate program that you're also, is affiliate marketing at all a part of what you do, referrals? How does that play into your business? Yes, there is a little bit of affiliate. So like Amazon and B&H are the two main ones because there's so much tech products. Pretty much anything I talk about or review you can find on one of those two sites. So we do have an Amazon affiliate program and a B&H affiliate program. Those still though, I mean, they're great that they exist and we definitely use them but they are right on the same level as merch basically where like if we cut that arm off right now we might not even remember to turn it back on. But again, if we did want to specifically focus on it we could turn that into its own business, its own revenue stream to some significance. There was a Tesla referral program by the way and that did go pretty well until they killed it. Oh, so that doesn't exist anymore? Not anymore. I mean, you still can get, so there was a very robust program where you eventually got a free Tesla Roadster. I think they'll just give the referrer like a thousand supercharging miles an hour or something like that, which is good. Yeah, that's cool. I mean, you're also one of the few people that Elon follows on Twitter, is that right? It's true, yeah. That's pretty crazy. Yeah, I try not to abuse that. I have been known to DM once in a while but I don't feel like, I don't want to waste his time. You know, he's sending stuff to Mars like I don't want to do you man, do you. Well, Mr. Beast is also sending stuff to Mars, so I guess, I don't know. Who's not sending stuff to Mars now, you know? Fair. I'm curious, as you look at this year, considering you have interviewed people like Elon Musk, President Obama, what are some like bucket list interviews you would love to get for your channel and for your community? I watch a lot of sports and so a lot of minor athletes and here's the thing about that list of people I've interviewed is I got thrown directly into the deep end. Like as a child, I interviewed the CEO of Motorola and then went straight to Kobe Bryant. Like there's no, there's no warm-up, there's no refining your skills before getting these like incredible videos and so it's kind of felt like, oh wow, the point of this series is to interview high-profile people but really the point of the series was to interview people and talk to people who have an interesting perspective on tech who might not look at tech the same way as you or me whether that's someone who's a CEO of a company because they have to have by definition like a five to 10 year vision of the future which can we talk about that? Or if it's an athlete who uses tech to make a better sports product, like that's cool too. So I think for me, a lot of these interview people are like the LeBrons of the world, like people who have an impact in more than just their own sport who have their foot in tech in some way. Athletes don't really get much time to keep up on the tech world. So a lot of times the conversation is just like about literal performance of apparel which is a very small piece of tech but I think it's fun anyway. I think those are like, yeah, LeBron would be a pretty fun interview obviously. What does this like version 2.0 of MKBHD look like now that you go into multiple YouTube channels? Like what can we expect in this next iteration of MKBHD? And if you want to tell us what the secret channel is, we can do that here and now. So here's what I'll tell you. It's like, you see the MKBHD channel that is Marques and Marques' opinions crafted by many hands in order to present it as well as possible. Each one of the people contributing to this has their own identity and their own things that they like and things that they're an expert on. That deserved to be showcased too. So that's something we think about a lot. That's something we're working on a channel for. The podcast also will get a video version as you mentioned. So I think the version 2.0, I guess is probably, it'll probably be like 4.0. I don't know. I sort of divided in phases in my head, but the new version of MKBHD I'm building is like one with a lot more visible moving parts. If you can imagine a transparent machine where you can see the gears turning, like it's very impressive, the final product and what the machine is doing, but you'll be able to look inside and see what the machine's doing while it's doing the thing, which I think is pretty fun. Does the weight of the publish button get heavier and get bigger? Because I think when you think about from where you started, where you're just taking a bunch of shots, it's just like video after video after video, especially in 2009, 2010, when you're growing. Now it's a different experience. Yeah, it's funny. When I started, it was just kind of like publishing and then not really expecting too much and then just moving on to making the next thing because that was what was fun. But after a certain point, you guys probably felt this too, is you get to a place where you've finished your video, you have the file, you know the whole thing, like the back of your hand, and you're already anticipating what the response or the reaction is going to be, what you think people will like about it, what you think people will comment on, what things you added, whether they'll catch them or not. And so when you describe the weight of the publish button, it feels like there's a little extra of like, I did all my research, I talked about everything I wanted to, I think I'm pretty thorough, but I never quite sure exactly how people are going to react to each little thing. So that keeps it fun. But I definitely think you're right, there's an added weight to publishing something new. It was something that we talked about quite a bit last year and we were both really impressed with the video that you put out during kind of the heightened racial tensions in the US. And we sat together and we're finding it so hard to find the words, but as your platform continues to grow, do you feel a level of responsibility or how do you, I guess, interact with big moments in the country like that but with the type of platform that you have? Yeah, I think what I've found is I have my own philosophy on celebrity, as weird as that word is, which is I only try to admire someone for the thing that they are like good at, the thing, the reason that they're who they are. For Tiger Woods, it's like greatest golf athlete I've ever seen. I look up to him for that and his work ethic and the talent in golf. And that's it. And so when people like see other headlines about Tiger or other stories about Tiger, I don't really care, like he's still Tiger the golfer. And I apply that across everything, across like Elon Musk, the entrepreneur and business person, across like Jeff Bezos, the Amazon inventor, basically all these things. But I've realized over time that that's not how most people look at it. And so with any form of a platform that you have, you automatically inherit this responsibility and this spotlight on like everything else you do. And so if there are other issues that you feel strongly about or other things that you have thoughts on and you share them, they will inherit part of the platform of like the original thing you do. So for me, it was like I do these tech videos and in theory, in my own world, the only thing anyone cares about in Marques land is what should I buy next in tech? But this is a time where so many other issues were weighing on me and speaking to me that I felt like because I understand that the spotlight is gonna be on other things, I have things to say about that. I might as well use it too. And I think there's other examples of people doing a great job with it. I think LeBron is another great example of like, whatever you think about him as a basketball player, he's obviously incredible, but his off the court presence and ability to create change and speaking out on issues that matter is super admirable. So if I can learn from anyone in that, I think that would be something to take in mind. Yeah, that's really great, man. I mean, honestly, like I think you've, like we mentioned about the interviews, you've done a lot in the creator community to continue opening new doors for all of us. And I really do think that your video last year was just so well articulated and something that we sent around to everyone that works here at our company. So love all the videos you put out, but that one particularly, I think really hit home for us and it was awesome. Thank you. So yeah. Are you at all nostalgic now? I think it's so unique that you've been on the platform so long before it could even be a career when it really had to be a hobby. And so much of it is documented from when you were such a young kid. Do you ever go back and watch those videos? I know Samir and I, like having also been on YouTube for 10 years, I don't think we go back and watch our old videos anymore, but we're definitely nostalgic at times for like the rise and the journey and where it's gone. A little tiny piece of me is, like I don't watch old videos, but I do like remember very clearly like that space on the internet where it's kind of like everything that happened felt almost like an accident. Instead, like when you see now, like creators blowing up and creators starting new channels and getting a lot of traction, everything seems very deliberate and contrived and on purpose. And I guess for some reason back then, maybe a little nostalgic piece of me is like people weren't really trying specifically to go viral all the time as much as they were just like, you know, uploading a video of themselves at the zoo or just like making it or did they capture something on their phone and that would be fun to share and they'd put it on YouTube so they could send the link to their mom, but then people found the video. Like it was that environment, I think is what I'm nostalgic about. But I don't watch my old videos. Yeah, it's, yeah, we definitely don't watch our old videos. Yeah, try to steer clear of them at this point. Well, really appreciate you coming on the show. Really appreciate you talking and you know, what we talked about, about education, we feel like these conversations can offer a lot of, you know, lessons in just the observation of how other creators are growing their businesses. And as this becomes more and more of a viable career, I think turning to conversations like this and probably for you looking back on this a couple of years down the line when MKBHD Enterprises as I'll call it is a bigger company with even more employees, it'll be interesting to see where you were at this time. I don't, I won't look back at old videos, but I'll look back at old places that we were as a business and I'll probably feel pretty good. So that's exciting. Thanks Marques. Yeah, you know, if it is a simulation, then we're all just characters in some random Sims game, I guess, basically. Yeah, we should probably start stocking up on Dogecoin to be able to transact with this simulation. Definitely. If you can get the coins, you'll be set.