Alain Delon : "J'ai un très très mauvais caractère" (1975)

Alain Delon, good evening and thank you for agreeing to participate in this special film that I have dedicated to you, since our interview will be followed later by Rocco et ses frères, a film by Lucchino Visconti that you shot in 1960, but we will talk about this film later. Before that, is it possible in a few minutes to approach you, to get to know you a little better, you who are very famous and ultimately very, very unknown to the general public. I recently read a book about you called Alain Delon, which is written by a boy named Mr. Rode and which appeared in the collection Tête d'Affiche. A book, by the way, which I was a little inspired by to ask you a few questions about your personality, very difficult to define. And I think you hate interviews because you say in this book, instinctively, I hate being asked questions. Is that true? Yes, I've always hated being asked questions. First, because I don't like answering them. And then, I'm going to make a very specific distinction, for me, there has always been in the life of a journalist, a press, and a certain press or another press. In your case, I think I will answer your questions, because I think it is very rare to have, let's say, capable interlocutors, not to say professionally intelligent, and in general, that's why the interviews I have the opportunity to do turn very quickly to the drama and stop very briefly. I'm going to make you a confession, I've often told you, I've seen you on other televisions than ours, and I felt at home, it appeared on the screen, a fantastic potential for aggressiveness before you were asked the slightest question, which is not the case today, by the way, if I may say so. It is certainly a kind of natural defense, which starts from the animal instinct, I think. But it is indeed an aggressiveness that I have in me, which certainly starts from the principle and the fact of attacking to defend oneself. So, let's look at the legend a little bit, if you don't mind, because it may be the time to demystify it. It is summarized in a few qualifications, one of which, Uncomfortable. It's the first, there are a few others. Yes, it's true, Uncomfortable, but I mean, there is a side of my professional life, that's one thing, and a side of my private life. I think this qualification refers to my private life, and the part of my private life, it's true, I'm not very comfortable. Authoritarian. Authoritarian, professionally, certainly, yes. Georges Lautner, with whom you shot Les Cinq Glaces, told me that he was terrified on the first days of shooting, and that afterwards, he only wanted one thing at the end of this shooting, to make a film with you again. Do you put people with whom you worked uncomfortable at first? I think I understood Georges' feeling, which I personally take as a compliment. That is to say, in the end, it is very difficult to say this in front of me, but I think that people, at first, are blocked because they don't know me. And you know that when you don't know someone, the most fanciful statements fly around his character, and in the end, in the end, it's a problem of ignorance. And I think that when you know me professionally, I hear, you see things quite differently. I think you would agree with the legend on a colorful qualification, that's true. It's true, yes. Even over the years, it's true. I think it's a question, it's a mark of character, I have a very, very bad character, I don't know if you have it on your sheets, on your papers, but it's a proof of character too, and it's better to have a bad character than no character at all. We're going to put a rose a little bit in his thorns. Courageous, that's true, you proved it in difficult circumstances. If you say so. And a taste for challenge too. A taste for risk, more than challenge. Obviously, the risk of the risk by the challenge, of course. So you said a sentence, I hope it's true, but you can authenticate it or deny it. You talked once about Belmondo and Briali, and you said, the public has the impression, and said, Belmondo, Briali, they are friends of mine, we never say that, yet the public admires you, and you follow, otherwise you wouldn't do the number of entries you do on your name. But are you frustrated not to have this kind of affection, very curious? No, because, frustrated surely, but I think I'm basically responsible for it, and if I'm responsible for it, it's probably because of an attitude on my part towards another life. Maybe I don't have access, an approach as easy as Jean-Claude or Jean-Paul, it's true, it's true. But I think it's a question of nature, and it's profoundly my nature. I'm not very open, it's a fact of some people, and I don't like to be approached inopinionally in the street by anyone. I react very badly, but I think it's a question of temperament. I apologize to those who may have been hurt or crushed. You also hate demagogy. This may explain this. Maybe, surely. Alain Delon, superstar, it's a term that often comes up. Do you accept this label? I willingly accept it, because, without talking about Alain Delon, I think there are in the world, and there are very few of what I call myself, without saying the super, very few stars. There are many stars, but very few stars, and I think I'm one of them. I read in the anthology of cinema, which is generally not a gift to actors, a sentence that concerns you, we say, just for Le Guépard, the history of cinema will never forget the name of Alain Delon, with a role that was perhaps the most humane of all his films. It pleases you, do you agree? Yes, it's a line that I would more willingly attribute to Visconti, and, as far as I'm concerned, that I would prefer to see on the subject of Rocco. There is one thing that strikes in your career, you have always been able, in most cases, to choose your films and your directors, and that can't be a coincidence. You know, for ten years, I have been both an interpreter and a producer of my films. We're going to talk about that, about being a producer. Yes, and in fact, it's probably since I've been a producer, in fact, it's probably the main interest of producer Alain Delon, is to finally be able to make the films he wants to make, and to go up, to form the teams he has formed, and that's probably my greatest strength as a producer. We'll talk later about your job as a producer. There is a period in your career called Hollywood. Yes. And Hollywood, it was an important turning point. What is left of it, the assessment, the memory assessment, the emotional assessment, the professional assessment, of course, on the whole, apart from the people you liked, that you met, I think, in Lancaster. Not much. Not much, no, I didn't meet Lancaster in Hollywood. Lancaster, it's in Le Guépard. It's in Le Guépard, and I found him later in Scorpio. Hollywood, professionally, not much, if not an interesting experience, it's always very interesting for a French actor, a European actor, to go and work for the Americans. That's interesting. But on the level of my career, I mean, the films I shot there were not exciting, the roles were not transcendent, and if you like, I very quickly understood that my place was not in America, but at home, in Europe, in our good old Europe. And I returned very quickly. The best memory of Hollywood is an extra-professional memory, since it is, for example, the birth of my son, who was born in Hollywood, while I was shooting films there. I didn't want to make an allusion, since you hate that we approach very particular parts of your life, your private life, and I understand it very well. But when we talk about Hollywood, I mean, French actors or directors, we always talk with tears in our eyes. That's where the real professionalism It's because they don't know. You have to know Hollywood, and we talk about it reasonably, without bloodshed in the way. It's very good on a technical level. It's true that in America, we benefit from the best technical means, the biggest advantages, on a technical level. But in the end, we make Hollywood cinema, as elsewhere, as in Switzerland, as in France, as in Italy. And yet, if you allow me a parenthesis, in your childhood, America was a dream. You once made a runaway to go to Chicago, which ended at the Chateaubriand police station, by the way. It's true, it's true. You know things. But you know, I think America is a dream for any European child, normally, and everyone dreamed of New York in his childhood, in his youth. And you know, in general, what has always troubled me, is that all the cities, all the countries, in general, which I dreamed of when I was a child, the day I found myself there, I was disappointed nine times out of ten. We should stay on these dreams. So, rock, palindrome, second time. That's it. There is one thing that struck me a lot in New York, that is, there are two characters, although you hate costume characters, I think that's one of the points, there is a character that you would have dreamed of playing, it's Bonaparte. I don't know if it's true, and if it's true, why? For the man? It's true, it's true, yes. It's true because, first of all, I've always had a boundless admiration for the man Bonaparte. I say Bonaparte, I don't say Napoleon. Including the nuance. And I think it's probably one of the most extraordinary roles and the most fascinating to play. You know, I think a referendum was held one day in the world to find out, at a global level, which were the most famous characters and the most known worldwide. Number one, Christ. That's the least of it. Number two, the emperor. And then there is a second character that you have not played, but that I still suspect you to think about it a lot and play it one day, it's the stranger of Camus. There, you make me think that you do it very badly because I think unfortunately... Mastroianni did it. But the remakes are also done. With Visconti. And I can even tell you that it was me at the beginning who had to do it and there were problems with Mr. Dino of Laurentiis to name him, the producer. And finally, it was Mastroianni who had the role of Camus. I think it's one of the biggest regrets of my professional life and certainly of my career and unfortunately I think that the stranger of Camus will never come back. Anyway, I don't see myself doing the stranger with someone else than Visconti. Well, we're going to maybe change the chapter, Alain Delon. We're going to talk about Alain Delon, producer. In fact, your company, Adelfilm, was founded in 68? In 68, yes. In 68. Good. So, there is a question that we can ask ourselves. Actor fully satisfied, refusing about 50 scenarios to choose one, the desire to produce. Why? The desire to produce because of the need for creation. Let me explain. I consider, as a creator, a director, an author, a writer, even a cinematographic but for me, an actor remains and will always remain an interpreter, as superb as he is in his interpretation. So, if you want, I needed creation and I found my form of creation in production. More precisely, in promotion. That is to say, I consider myself, if you will, at the first stage when I prepare a film, as a promoter. Take the case of Borsalino or the case of Flextone. I read from Borsalino where I find, I read the first pages of Flextone. I see the interest in making a film and from that moment on, the machine starts and says, I want to make Borsalino or I want to make Flextone. First point, buy the rights, find the rights. Second point, think of a director. From the director to the author, to the adapter, to the writer, to the distribution, to the actors. That is my work as a promoter. I set up the case totally. What interests you the most? That is what interests me the most. It is my creation, in all modesty. Then comes the work of the producer. All the preparation of the film, then the work of the actor. I make room, I give room to the actor during the shooting period and the producer takes his place in the third stage of the film which is the stage of the completion, of the finish and of the advertising and of the release of the film, etc. What availability is left for you and yours? You know, I always have it. When we want to find time, we always find it. But I think I find the availability in myself. First of all, I don't need so much availability if it is for others. But I find it, I find it like everyone else. I find it on Saturday, I find it on Sunday, I find it in the evening when I get home, I find it at night, I find it outside of my work. I think it is necessary to specify one thing so that there is no misunderstanding. The European conception of the producer is a man who finds one point of money. And there is the American conception of the producer which really follows the artistic creation. So you get closer to the second formula. I am totally a producer said in the American way, in the absolute sense. A producer is a man who, from the beginning, from the birth of the idea until the release of the film, follows his project, follows his film, his child, as we call it, to bring it to an end. Alain Delon, producer, creation, of course, but maybe also a way to bring to the screen themes that hold you close. There is a theme that holds you particularly close. I think, for example, you are against the death penalty. Not exactly. This is another discussion that we are going to address. I am not resolutely against the death penalty. But how could you produce two men in the city if you are not against the death penalty? You know, my role is the speech of an actor. I mean, it is to be, if you will, in a certain sense, apolitical. We know that you are more than an actor. Yes, I am also a producer. But in the case of two men in the city, I wanted to make the film, I produced it, I wanted to interpret this character. And I mean, the story was so written by José Giovanni that the end was what it was. Well, I mean, at that moment, it is not my purpose to have an opinion for or against. At that moment, I become an interpreter and I try to make something go through and I do it thoroughly and I play the game thoroughly. The condition is to believe in the theme. You know, the role of the actor is not necessarily to believe in the theme if it becomes... My political opinions, we know them. An actor, I think, has to stay on a professional level apolitical. What if I was offered a leftist role in the cinema? Right away. And I would do it with the maximum of my means, right away. But it is the role of the actor. Otherwise, it is not worth being an actor. This is what I reproach the leftist actors. There is another field, it is Alain Delon and the theatre. I think we have to be very precise. You are not a man to stay on failures or being an optimist, let's say, half-successes. There were two experiences in my knowledge, the one in a production of Visconti with, for partner, Romy Schneider which was called Dommage qu'elle soit une putain and there were the eyes of Jean Caux. Well, as you recognized it, half-successes or half-failures, etc. Didn't you want to do theatre again? Before bringing a rectification, both plays were a success. I mean, concerning the play of Visconti, we played, I think, with Romy something like 140 performances and the play, we stopped it at full performance because I had a cinematographic contract which I could not postpone which was, unfortunately, Marco Polo. Yes, but the critics of the time said that it was Romy who took everything away. Ah, you told me about a success. You didn't tell me about a critical success. I'm talking about a popular success. The critics were not always tender with me. It's a fact that Romy was in the play absolutely phenomenal. It's true. Romy has always been a theatre beast. I'm not a theatre actor and I was at my beginnings. I was probably less good than her. It's true. But the play was a success. As for the second play of Jean Caux with Marie-Belle on the critical level and on the actor level, it was a triumph. Except that the play was played 28 times because it was stopped as you probably know in May 1968. So I can't know if it would have been a long-term success but the critics were unanimous both on the play and on Marie-Belle and on Alain Delon. And you, who lived in Saint-Aleur, the theatre, isn't it a tempo a little too slow, a little too routine, 300 performances? It's true. I could never, unfortunately, I regret it, but I could never play in a theatre 300 nights in a row or 600 or whatever, no. I would love to be able to create a play and play for a minimum or a maximum of 30 or 40 performances. I think it's, given my personality and my temperament, it's the maximum. I couldn't lock myself in the theatre for a year. It's true. I regret it. Maybe there's a man who could bring you back to the theatre, it's Patrice Chéreau. Didn't you want to work with him? Yes, we even had a project. Well, Patrick told me one day about his desire to do something in the theatre with me, but I'm still waiting for the ideal play. And then, a third part, it's Alain Delon, Alain Delon, businessman. So, there's a sentence, you say, the middle of the cinema is made up of sharks, but it turns out that the shark is the fish I prefer. Is that the exact quote? We can check as we go along. Yes, let's say I feel comfortable among the sharks. Well, but do you think that the world of sport in which you have dived successfully is a softer world made up of nice people? I don't think so, but let's say I was lucky or the circumstances made me approach the world of sport at the highest level with the best organizations, if you will. By making a lot of people suffer, by the way. Surely, but the problem is not making people suffer. As they are not my personal friends, I don't want to have any damage to the subject. So, I have flourished the world of sport, but I have flourished it in the way that there was more grandiose, more important, more... So, I don't know the world of sport in the way that you have underlined. But I think the world of sport is also a world full of sharks. We have talked a lot about boxing business as well as sport business. It's a fact, but it's not a problem that affected me. I did my business on my own, without anyone. There was no business that mattered more than mine. And horses, is it a passion or is it a challenge at the jockey club? Ah, it's not at all. Horses are a passion, pure and simple. First of all, it's an animal for which I always had a special affection. A horse, well, it's... it's pure blood, as they say. And I was attracted since my earliest childhood to horses. And I always dreamed, I always wanted to have horses one day of my own, not to ride them because I am, unfortunately... You know that anyway, my horse is in the trot, not in the gallop, so I drive them. And I always dreamed later to have a racing horse which I managed to achieve a few years ago. If you please, there is something that strikes me and forgive me for the brutality of the question. Alain Delon, you are a successful actor, but it seems to me that... That I succeed better in horses than as an actor. ...that you want something else. Well, let's say, I use the word, that you want to give up this Saltinbank label which is that of the acting profession in everything that is noble. It was Gabin who gave it to us. Yes. And isn't there a concern for notoriety of Alain Delon, businessman, director of a charter company, racing horse, combat organizer, from there to the Legion d'Honneur? No, the Legion d'Honneur, I tell you straight away, I am not interested at all. The Legion d'Honneur must be interested as a military given by General de Gaulle. Out of that, I am not interested. No, notoriety, you know, I think it is difficult to reach a notoriety in all modesty more important than the one I had thanks to my acting profession and as a producer in the whole world. So, it is not a concern for me. It is not my business or my racing horse or my charter company that will bring me a notoriety more obvious or more affirmed than the one I had. No, it is simply a need for action, a need to renew new passions. I am someone who burns passions and burns them and throws them away to take new ones, to discover new ones. It is a need to live, not as we are used to to say at 100 km per hour or 1,000 km per hour, to simply live. It is a need not to waste time. I estimate, but I have always said that I did not have time to waste time and that from the day I understood that every day I was getting closer to the final outcome, to the fatal outcome, I did not want to waste a second of this time. An obsession when it comes to the finality? It is not an obsession, it is a certainty. It is the only thing in the world that I am sure and certain of, that is to die. We will come back to Alain Delon, actor, after these brackets. Alain Delon, you shot with the greatest directors, we can mention Melville, Antonioni, Visconti, René Clément, Lozet, but Visconti, isn't it an important date in your cinematographic career? It is certainly the most important date, if not one of the most important because it is part of the very beginning of my career. That is to say that if you will, I consider the career of an actor as a building. A career is built let's say as a building over a long period of time and to build a building you first need foundations and solid foundations otherwise the building collapses, everything falls. And I believe that my foundations, the foundations of Alain Delon's career must be attributed to Visconti. My meeting with Visconti, Visconti's choice to give me the interpretation of Rocco, the character of Rocco in Rocco and his brothers and the first foundations of my acting that I learned from his contact because you can only learn with people like Visconti and then the cheetah and... We will talk again about Visconti and naturally about Rocco but with all these directors that I have enumerated and there are many of them what is the contribution of each one? For example what is the contribution of a René Clément in the direction of an actor, of an Antonioni, of a Lozet, of a Melville? You mentioned the greatest those who are part of the profession of the greatest directors in the world Clément for example that I had the chance to shoot I think it was the greatest year and the greatest chance of Alain Delon's career was to have shot the same year in 1960 Rocco and his brothers under the direction of Visconti and Plain Soleil under the direction of René Clément that remain it's not me who says it that remain and will remain two classics of world cinema as a film of Visconti and a film of René Clément so if you want I had this chance René Clément who is still one of the greatest directors in France and in the world and for me he will remain I think the greatest the one who directed me as the greatest director of actors you know there is a distinction people forget too often what is a director there is for me the director who must be dubbed by a director of actors what I would reproach to directors in general now is to be only directors and maybe not to like actors to have a lot of knowledge of the actor not to like actors not to respect not to feel the actor and not to draw from the actor the maximum and finally draw from the actor what the others never drew it's the strong point of Visconti of Clément of Antoinette of Melville and people like that it's to bring out in an actor what no one has ever brought out before but you who have the taste of risk you never wanted to go to the other side of the camera it's curious very often of course but I do not go there for two reasons first the first because director it's a job and we do not improvise director we become it by force of work by force of years of study and we can not in my opinion accumulate at the same time the job of producer of director and actor everyone is not Wells is not Wells who wants and many of my comrades are attached attacked and it gave for me in my opinion results that are very mediocre so we can not do three jobs well at the same time and the second reason if you want is that I have the ability to make a film I make a film tomorrow morning but as I just tell you I make a film and when I work with XYZ I realize that tomorrow morning I can do the same thing better than him or better than and when I redo a film with Visconti or a film with Losey or with Melville I put everything in question because I realize that I will never that I can not do like them so I forget to make the mise-en-scene we come back to Rocco Rocco and his brothers you played the role of a boxer in this film there is a fight I think it was filmed at the Vigorelli in which you fight it is a real fight yes I was then 25 years old that's what gave Abel Mondeau the idea to do boxing after absolutely not Jean Paul did boxing well before because Jean Paul was a boxer before being an actor he was an amateur boxer he became an actor then it was the opposite that happened with me yes the scene was shot at the Vigorelli in Milan in the presence of 4 to 5,000 people and I had to give myself the line fortunately for me and fortunately for the film a professional boxer at the time who was a boxer of a quality and a very rare class who was called Sauveur Chiocca yes he was an average champion of France he was champion of France I think he even was maybe even European champion I don't want to say I mean he was a boxer who had a class of world champion but who unfortunately had a major flaw in his specialty he was a boxer who was afraid you know that fear when you are a boxer is an absolutely ridiculous thing You were surrounded by Renato Salvatori who we find in Flixstory one of the films you made Annie Girardo yes how did the shooting Do you have a memory still well it's old of course but what remains as a memory that resurfaces? Well you know first it's like I said one of the most important films of my career it was my meeting also with Renato with whom I stayed very close my meeting with Girardo we were all at the time a bit of beginners small actors but I think what remains on the surface and that surges that will always come out if you want of this surface I think it's the wonderful presence and the wonderful genius of Visconti you can't have made a film with Visconti without remembering all his life without being marked all along his career and that's the most important thing