Watch Talk _ Vintage Watch Dealer and Expert, Eric Wind of Wind Vintage

Ladies and gentlemen, we tricked him into coming back, making his triumphant return to this channel is Eric Wind, founder of Wind Vintage, co-host of the Vintage Watch Podcast, and I heard a rumor you have some episodes you're filming while you're here in New York. We're working on a few for sure. Eric, I want to start this conversation in a way that you don't like to start these conversations, but we have to ask, what's on the wrist? Today I have a Galet Filmmeter Multikron 45. It's a very rare watch designed for kind of film photographers back in the day when they had actual physical film and recording it in yards or meters. It's the first one I've had in kind of 15 years of collecting Galet chronographs. There's really only two of the vintage chronographs that had this kind of feature on the dial. One is the Universal Geneve Film Compacts, which there's less than 10 known, and this is the Galet, kind of a similar amount known to the market. Very few exist. I sold a film compact earlier this year, so it's nice to have the Galet version offered as well. Yeah, probably from the wrist of some super producer. In Hollywood, probably. Yeah, I don't know the exact provenance, but it'd be cool if I did. Before we get into like knitted, gridded kind of stuff, just getting a general sense, you know, the primary watch market has been through a lot of ups and downs. I guess let's focus more on the vintage side since that's your specialty. What are consumers leaning towards, for example, in the last 12 months? I'm happy to report vintage is doing very well. Yeah, you've had one of your best months ever, right? We did, yeah, and I think the modern, as I call it, the modern watch industrial complex, you know, had really overshadowed vintage the last few years. That's obviously changed. It's kind of a, as President Warren Harding would say, return to normalcy, where very few things sell for more on the secondary market and people are being a little more thoughtful about how they spend their money in the world of watches. So I see a lot of people returning to what they originally liked with vintage watches. People are seeing value again in this because it was honestly hard to convince someone coming into the world of watches to buy vintage when they are trying to establish dealer relationships and just buy as much as they could. I know people that literally would buy every single watch offered to them from an AD for Rolex or Patek or AP, and they have a safe full of unworn watches in the boxes, and they've realized, hey, that white gold Pepsi sells way lower on the secondary market now. So there is a return to normalcy. There's a return to vintage. People are much more condition-oriented now. They're more cognizant of how rare certain watches are. The kind of condition, condition, condition thing where people will pay a premium for top condition, original condition watches is kind of increasing by the day. So speaking of the three Cs, condition, condition, and what was it? Condition. Condition, yeah, exactly. As someone who's been in the game for so long, what do you look for in terms of condition? What else should people keep an eye on? Just as a kind of an example, this is an Omega Speedmaster 145.022-69, and I found it from a lady in Texas. Basically, the watch had never been opened until I received it. Had a little bit of the original red wax on the side from when it left the Omega factory, but it's just a spectacular condition in terms of the bezel. It's got a little bit of fade. The dial's faded to a tropical brown, very even. It's all unpolished. It looks like it was not worn a lot. Not a big surprise when we put this up for sale on the site. It sold in less than a day, and we basically had four or five people wanting to buy it. That brings me to the next question I wanted to ask, which is, you have such a finger on the pulse of the vintage market. What have your clients been gravitating towards? What kind of trends have you emerged as far as brands and models that have been hits recently? Vintage Rolex is still the majority of our business, and it's kind of a can't-miss. It's always a great watch, a great choice. Yeah, we've got a few here, right? Yeah, whether you're talking about a vintage GMT Master, a vintage Sub. Vintage Subs were actually pretty difficult to sell the last two years. I don't know quite why that is, except people were focused on the Gerald Genta-style watches, Royal Oaks, Nautilus, etc. We've definitely seen a return of the Sub this year. A lot more interest in finding great condition Subs, particularly from the 60s, 70s, and 80s. Any particular references? That's a 5512. My colleague Charlie Dunn wrote a great collector's guide to the 5512, and now there's a ton more interest in 5512s than there was previously. People didn't really understand the difference. You were talking on the pod about how the differences between a 5513 and a 5512. Yeah, go into that a little bit. The 5512 is chronometer rated, so it usually says Superlative Chronometer Officially Certified on the dial. The very earliest 5512s were not, but around 1962 Rolex differentiated and created the 5513 as the non-chronometer rated watch, and they designated the 5512 as the chronometer rated watch. They made both through the 1980s, but the 5512 now has gotten a lot more interest because people want the slightly better movement. It's kind of like the same with vintage cars, where there's a premium paid for the more performance-oriented cars of a given manufacturer rather than the stock models. Speaking of trends, we've seen brands like Cartier get a lot more attention, and that's even trickled into Piaget a little bit, into more integrated bracelet styles. Is that lasting, or do you see that fading off? I think Cartier has a lot of power to endure, but it's been superheated kind of the last year or so. It's been almost like a race to grab as many vintage Cartiers as possible for some collectors. It's definitely hyped. A lot of people don't want to wear vintage Cartier watches every day because it doesn't really match their lifestyle, or if it's very humid, these aren't really great watches. More on the precious side. They're more precious. The movements aren't that great. You're buying more of a design watch, but it's a beautiful watch. It's a beautiful dress watch. It's not really what I aspire to wear every single day. It's kind of one of those things where it's pushed the boundaries of the amount of people that pay attention, so the market is much broader now for those things, and I think it's kind of stabilizing because there's a wider base of people. It's not just the same 20 people that are hyping it, so I think Cartier is kind of here to stay, vintage Cartier. That leads us nicely into my next question, which is what hidden gems out there are people sleeping on? What really cool stuff? I'd say we have a lot of things on this table that I'd never seen before. Maybe even just we start with this Rolex here. This is a very non-Rolex Rolex that I think could get a lot of attention, at least would be great for the right buyer. Yes, it's a reference 9022. They made a number of models under the Precision line in the 1950s that are large, very wearable, more like Patek Philippe Calatrava. Obviously snapback cases. Typically this is an unpolished example under $5,000 on a Gayfraer bracelet. It's an incredible value. It's less than a much more common vintage Datejust. It's very large, wearable. No, it's not water resistant, but it's a really cool watch. There's other kind of random watches like a Movado coin watch, you know, not common that has the original box, which is super rare. It makes a fun little desk companion or for your bookshelf or your pocket, whatever you want to do. Definitely have seen a lot more interest in 26 to 31 millimeter Rolex watches for ladies. They're relatively inexpensive. This is under $4,000 and essentially mint condition, unpolished sticker on the back really looks hardly worn at all with a blue dial. It's really a fun watch and it's got a big bracelet. So really anyone can wear that watch just about. 34 millimeter watches like, you know, Date models, Air Kings, et cetera, under $5,000 for unpolished condition examples. And like a watch you can wear and enjoy the rest of your life every day. That one has an engine turned bezel. So it's pretty uncommon from circa 1988 to 1989. Very sleek. I feel like one of the nice side effects about, you know, vintage Calatrava is having a little bit of a moment and like vintage Cartier having a little bit of a moment is that there's more flexibility in people's minds about case sizes, things like that. So they might be more willing to go for a 34 millimeter Rolex than they would have been exactly. And it has a nice presence on the wrist, even if you're a big person, it's a great watch. Yeah. And for those who like the Datejust, a 34 millimeter OP Date is an equally good option. Yeah, exactly. Markets have their ups and downs and things like that. As someone who's so knowledgeable about vintage, you know, where would you recommend as far as someone who's just looking for like good, stable value, like a good watch that's not gonna, you know, might not blow up, but it's also if they needed to have an exit plan. Yeah. Could get out of a fairly easy. I think that 34 to 36 millimeter Rolex, whether you're talking about an Air King, a Date model or a Datejust, just get one in excellent condition, ideally unpolished case. And it's pretty liquid. It's, buy it and check that it's water resistant. You can really enjoy it. They're essentially bulletproof movements, very easy to service and maintain. When you get into other stuff, you know, vintage Piaget, Cartier, et cetera. It's almost like investing in the S&P 500 versus NASDAQ. You know, they could go up or it could go down. It's less liquid, if you will. So I would generally encourage someone to think about a mainstream vintage Rolex as a first purchase, or if they think they might need to sell it down the road. And just to stretch that question a little bit further on the higher end of the market, you know, we've seen things like Royal Oaks really like take a dive and things like that. Are there good opportunities to buy at the higher end for things like that? Or have you seen conversely like ones that have like proven to be very stable over the last six months to a year or so? The two watches I'd probably asked for most would be a great Rolex Explorer 1016, whether you're talking about a gilt example from the 1960s or a matte dial from the 1970s and 80s. Those are just great, solid, somewhat stealthy watches you can wear every day. And we always have people looking for top quality condition, unpolished examples, if you can find them. Above that, the Patek Philippe reference 3940 Perpetual Calendar, which at 25 years ago, that watch was about $100,000. And they still sell for say 50 to 60 for a yellow gold example, that's full set or a bit more, but still less than those watches cost 25 years ago. Fantastic, very thin wearable watches. They can need service because they're so thin that a caliber 240Q movement is a little bit tricky because it's a micro rotor and it's very complex for how much information is packed into that thin movement, but fantastic watch that you can always love and wear and seems to be very stable if not growing in value and interest. So let's do a hands-on. What's one watch on the table you'd say pats a lot of punch for the price? Definitely a Rolex Day-Date or President. This is a reference 18038 from the 1980s. Most of these have champagne gold dials. This one has a black dial. It's way less common, maybe one out of every 40 or 50 I see has a black or a blue dial. If someone saw you wearing this, they would probably think it's a $50,000 watch, but we're talking about half that in terms of price for an unpolished example with a tight, nice bracelet. Things to look for when you're looking at a vintage Day-Date. Often the bracelets are super stretched, so you know it's sagging down here if you didn't have one of these side shots. Often the lugs are super polished and thin. Unfortunately, a lot of people like to polish these, so this is an unpolished example that's been worn and enjoyed but is still in really nice condition. Yeah, maintains the case architecture and the original lines and everything. And I think it's got kind of that vintage charm, a brand new 36 millimeter Day-Date on bracelet. By the time you pay tax and walk out the door, you're talking about $40,000 plus. This is significantly less expensive, so for me, this packs a big punch. You can go kind of from there into something more unusual like this Omega or Omega. This is from the 1950s. It's a reference 2714. Not common, but you know, these are great value. Solid 18 karat gold. Beautiful pieces, whether you're talking about Constellation, Seamasters. This particular example, which is not part of any named family, but it's automatic. It's large. Very large for the decade. Yeah, exactly. Someone would look at that from a distance and maybe think it's a Patek Philippe Calatrava or something else, but it's a really cool, beautiful watch. Kind of related to the Day-Date, I really like these 26 millimeter Rolex Datejusts, which were obviously marketed toward women originally. This is a very mint, unpolished example as well, and we're talking under $10,000. Oh wow, for solid gold too. Yeah, so for the money, there's not a lot that's better. It's water resistant, wearable, good for moms, all kinds of things. I love this bracelet too. Before I even put this thing down, this is so I love vintage bracelets, woven, interesting textures. I can't say enough about the beauty of a vintage Gayfraer bracelet, like on this model, the 9022. To me, that's one of those things I really love about vintage watches, are the great bracelets. Yeah, no kidding. Because you have a lot of variety within Rolex, not just talking about the inlays, of course, but you have rivet style versus folded link, which is something a little bit different. I like a thin bracelet on the wrist personally. Yeah, especially the newer ones are chunky. They're heavy and yeah, that's fun. So looking ahead while looking back, vintage watches, of course, if you think about the next six months, 12 months, what do you see kind of coming to the fore in the vintage watch landscape? I think Universal Geneve is going to remain on fire as people are excited for the relaunch of the company. Breitling purchased it last year for around $60 million. So I'm on the advisory board for the company. It's been amazing to see Universal Geneve go from kind of a quiet brand to the last several years with a very small group of hardcore dedicated collectors to much more mainstream. Almost every great Universal Geneve we put up on winvintage.com sells in a day or two now, which is a stark difference from kind of 12 to 18 months ago. So keep an eye out for really great Universal Geneve models. Any models from yesteryear in particular that you're hoping make the re-edition? I love the Tricompax, of course. It's such a beautiful watch starting in the 1940s, very complicated. The Polerouter has been very strong. They're still relatively inexpensive. Yeah, given everything that you get with the Polerouter. Yeah, it could be $3,000 to $5,000 for a great example. You're talking about a really robust, great cases, great dials, movements, automatic movements. I actually prefer the bumper examples that are early. It's got a little bit bigger case and 19 millimeters between the lugs than the micro rotor examples that followed. And it's hard to find really great examples. Most are polished. Most have kind of a lot of wear on the dial, etc. But any great Polerouter, I would encourage people to think about purchasing. Eric, always a pleasure seeing you here in New York City. Thanks for bringing these watches and for sharing your expertise on the vintage watch market. This has been our conversation with Eric Nguyen, founder of Nguyen Vintage and co-host of the Vintage Watch Podcast. Give it a listen and leave a review. Thanks so much for watching. We'll see you next time.