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Joining us now to discuss Homeland Security surge of federal agents to Minneapolis with hundreds more expected yet both yesterday and today is Simon Heninson, senior research fellow at the Heritage Foundation's Border Security and Immigration Center. Great to have you with us this morning, Simon. Amid investigations into last week's fatalized shooting and tens of thousands of people marching through Minneapolis this weekend in protest, what do you make of the surge of officers there? Well, it's it's all part of the political theater that's being played out. And what's behind that is the more fundamental question, the existential question, which is what does law and order mean in the United States. We have Mayor Fry, who is a political pander of unbelievable proportions, out there claiming that Minneapolis is an incredibly safe city until all of a sudden law enforcement from the federal government came and tried to do its job. Uh Minneapolis had 175 murders last year, 10,000 violent assaults, 2,000 rapes, and about a thousand incidents of law enforcement being assaulted. So why is this mayor concentrating on this one tragic case uh involving a a protester who very likely attempted felonious uh interfering with federal law enforcement officers and very sadly lost her life. It's because of politics. So unfortunately the the political theater is what we're getting treated to rather than what are these guys doing? They're there to remove people who are here in the country illegally. Very often serious criminals, recidivists who've come into the country illegally time and time again. And they're just simply doing a job that that they were appointed to do that they swore an oath to do and that Congress authorized them to do through legislation. So, how should people understand the legal rights and obligations at play in this particular incident with Nicole Good? >> Well, they could, you know, pick up a copy of the Constitution and read it. They could look at uh the statutes. They could read newspapers. Uh there's the First Amendment, which entitles you to protest uh if you don't like something that's happening in your community, something political. Uh but it is also illegal to interfere with federal law enforcement going about their duty, which includes lawfully arresting people who are arrestable. And that's the thing that that is being spun, I think, so uh uh wrongly and and really maliciously by so many politicians and activists on the left is the idea that somehow these federal agents are a goon squad sent by Trump to kidnap innocent American citizens off the street. That's simply not what is happening. They are going pursuant to lawful orders, either deportation orders or search warrants or the so-called due process to arrest people and then carry out due process and either deport them or have them go to court and defend why they should be allowed to stay in the United States. This is just the normal process of law. And what these sanctuary city mayors like Jacob Fry and governors like Tim Walls are asking is that the federal government just not enforce federal law in their city or their state. just stay outside. We've had this before. It happened in about 1861 and it ended up in a civil war that cost 600,000 lives. >> So, with that precedent in mind, where do we go from here? Um, how can the nation move forward through this rocky phase? >> Uh, I'm a pessimist at this point. Um, I I honestly don't know how we get through this um and and what the process is. I'm an optimist in the long term because I believe in America. We've had 250 uh magnificent years and I hope we have another 250 ahead of us. But right now, we're stuck in this sort of cycle of of peak stupid where people choose to believe what they want to believe regardless of the facts. They don't take a deep breath and try to evaluate the circumstances. You know, this case uh was a tragic one. Um but if you look at the facts, uh it it it will have a solution. either the officer was doing what he was supposed to do uh and there was a tragic result or he broke some kind of rule or process in which case he will be uh he'll be punished for it administratively or criminally if that's necessary. Um but people are ignoring that and they're just simply going to defcon 3 or one I think it is um and saying we should have no immigration law enforcement. We should have no law enforcement. We should abolish the police, defund the police. Um so yeah, how we get through this I don't know. better education uh you know one can only hope. >> Let's look uh take another tack here. In a Daily Signal article last week, you say that some elements within society want to stoke division and that they may be using the tragic events of the past week to do so. Um as well as presumably many other events uh in recent years. But tell me about your research and any findings related to this element that you've highlighted. >> Well, I think you know, you always have to find out who benefits from from rioting, from violence, from whatever the outcome is in this particular case. Now, I definitely the Trump administration has taken a very hard line on this to say that that that this, you know, woman was an activist or some people called her a domestic terrorist. Um, and on the left they've said she was a completely innocent, you know, mom dropping off her kids who knew nothing about activism and just was in the wrong place at the wrong time. You know, somewhere in there, uh, there are the facts. But who benefits from this poor woman's death? It is not the Trump administration. The Trump administration is trying to carry out law enforcement operations on a mass scale. Yes, because that's what President Trump promised. Uh, they're getting a lot of bad publicity about it. Obviously, the base loves it, but you know, the entire left establishment, the Democratic party can't stand it and would like to abolish the very agency that's carrying this work out. So, in this particular case, I don't see any benefit to the Trump administration by having somebody uh injured or killed in one of these uh street demonstrations. But I see a lot of benefit for the political left, the abolitionists uh who want to abolish law enforcement. They want to abolish ICE, and they essentially want to have open borders. this uh is a martyr for them in the way that George Floyd was a martyr that allowed a raft of of policies and actions and activities and fundraising and political victories over the next two to three years. Um so in in my analysis I think the political advantage here is all on one side. And lastly, just briefly, Simon, uh anything you think protesters should understand um to interact with law enforcement in effective but also safe ways and any reforms you think could be u effective at just tamping down on any escalation of violence that could be in the works. >> You know, law enforcement is not the other. They're not foreigners. They're not coming in from another country. These are your brothers and your fathers and your neighbors. People who have taken a job, sworn an oath. And look, I've lived in eight countries. I've traveled all over the world. The level of restraint and professionalism among US law enforcement is extraordinary. Like I said, Minnesota last year. A thousand law enforcement officers were attacked. How many of them ended up shooting their attacker? I I don't I didn't see one when I was doing my very brief research. These officers are going out of their way. In Iran, just over the past couple days, we've had what, 500 people at minimum, maybe 2,000 people deliberately shot for protesting and in many cases just being in the wrong place at the wrong time by the repressive Iranian authorities. Go around the world and see how police and authorities deal with protesters. We are an incredible model. And so protesters should understand that this is not personal between them and the agents. They have a right to protest and they can vote and they can change their congressman and try to change the laws, but they cannot attack these guys, vilify them, dox them, go after their families and and treat them as if they're the other. >> Both rights and responsibilities. Thank you so much, Simon Henson. Good to speak with you this morning. >> Thank you.