French protests: 'It's only when public, private sector act together that you can make changes'

Hundreds of thousands of people are set to take to the streets across France this Thursday. Demonstrators are demanding improved conditions at schools and universities, as well as the cost of living crisis continues to worsen and wages stagnate. Unions called for today's strike after negotiations with the government yielded no results. France's interior minister says 70,000 police are being deployed as authorities seek to prevent the unrest which erupted on the 17th of October. Clovis Casali filed this report. I'm outside Lycée Corbusier High School in Aubervilliers, in one of the poorest parts of France, in Saint-Denis, a Paris suburb. Behind me you can see pupils who are blocking the school. The school has been closed for weeks now, ever since the movement began. Students here also blocking the street, disrupting traffic, and police forces tried to dislodge them earlier. There were scenes of tensions with some here, protesters, sending firecrackers and fireworks at the police as crowds were chanting, We all hate the police. Today, an important day for their movement. As high school pupils, students are joining forces with trade unions across the country. The country, an estimated 700,000 people expected to take to the streets and authorities mobilising 70,000 police forces to prevent violence from taking place, to prevent the looting of small shops, of big shops, as it happened in previous demonstrations. So authorities on high alert, keen to make sure that there is no violence in the protests today across the nation. Clovis Casali reporting there. For more on this story, we can bring in Ariane Bourguin, lecturer in French and politics at Northumbria University, as well as France 24's French politics editor, Mark Perlman. Thank you both for being with us here today. Ariane, let me start with you. The French president convened a defense council meeting yesterday ahead of today's protest. We have these demonstrations that are coming today after weeks of protests. Every single weekend, we have protests here in France. Is Emmanuel Macron likely to listen to this continued movement we're seeing on the streets? My answer, you know, the thing is, they got it wrong on 17th of October, they underestimated the number of protesters. As a result, the police, you know, was outnumbered in some parts and overwhelmed in some parts. And since then, they kind of swung hard the other way towards a very securitarian response, you know, to try and kind of snuff it out. But, But, you know, you can be as repressive as you want. The grievances are still here, and today is another demonstration to be heard. And, you know, as I said before, you can be as repressive as you want. Until you listen, it will continue. And what I would say as well is, yes, it's important to know what the government can do. But, you know, it needs a political response. It needs a strong political response. So what we should be doing is move beyond the kind of focus on security. And we need to ask all the candidates for the upcoming presidential election, what are you going to do? How are you going to tackle? Because those grievances... have been here for years. They're nothing new. So we need to move away from focusing on security only and really put the grievances back at the centre of attention. Mark, does the French government have any cards to play? Not much. That's been the problem, and that's why the protesters, and they've said it publicly, they know that they have an extremely weak government, an extremely weak prime minister, struggling to present a budget in parliament as we speak, and essentially the coffers are empty, according to the government, so they don't have lots of carrots to offer to this protest movement. Today, it's important because it's different. than the Saturdays we talked about because this is a more traditional strike and demonstration organized by the main unions in France and this was initially a movement to really protest you know the issue of purchasing power the high price of oil and so on and it kind of merged with the movement in high schools and so the the unions it's also important for them because they need to In the streets, apparently, there are lots of people. But then, will they continue? Will the strike go on and so on? This will also determine the response of the government. The government has already said, well, we might decide to raise the minimum wage, which is traditionally happening on January 1st. On December 1st, and also not only according to inflation, but maybe a little bit higher, this could be a kind of response. They've also said that there's a popular savings scheme called Livre here in France, where you could put more money and hence maybe lands to the region so they can rebuild some of the high schools. This is one of the demands. But it's, you know, bits and bits. It's not like a really strong. ...coherent response, the government is probably hoping that the fact that there have been less... The blockages of high school in recent days because kids are going back to school, that this will hopefully die down. And the president said it himself we're six months away from a presidential election. Thank Basically, you should ask the candidates rather than me what they want to do, because there's very little I can do. But clearly, the movement took a momentum of its own. you And it's going to be interesting what happens today, but especially in the coming days. very Arianne, Mark raised an interesting point because we have seen fewer high schools, much much. fewer high schools impacted this week after students returned from their autumn vacations. But has the concessions that the government has made quelled that anger? Because we are seeing students take to the streets today. Well, it's clear that obviously there were quite a lot of announcements last week. And I think... For some students, it seems to be okay, but for many students, it's still not enough. And in a way, you know, it is a victory for them. They did get something, so you may as well continue to try and get more. It's kind of classic, you know, demonstration. You know, you try to get more out of it. And I think, you know, the strategy of the government, if I can call this, is to try and ride out the storm through a mixture of... tough law and order approach and concession slash mini announcements. So as Nero was said before, it's likely that the minimum wage will be increased, possibly announced tomorrow. There's also been some negotiation over youth and employment. And the government has been very, you know, has publicized the decrease in the price of petrol. Even though we know it's just temporary and I think it's probably hoping that it might last until Christmas and then comes January that the kind of presidential election is going to take over. But to come back to what we said as well about the trade union, obviously the numbers today, the number is important. But we need to know who is participating. So it's not just the overall number. Is it mainly public sector? So I'll... And do we have a lot of students? Do we have Yellow Vests? And even more crucially, do we have the private sector? Because historically, it's only when you have public and private sector together that you can make changes. And also, as any trade union would tell you, one successful day of action is not enough. You need to sustain it. So I fully expect the unions to announce new dates. And it might even go pan-European because there are suggestions that at the end of November, there might be a coordinated kind of trade union-led protest. Mark, you mentioned that Emmanuel Macron is hoping to kick the can down the road for whoever becomes president next in this country to deal with the anger and the discontent. Which we're seeing out on the streets right now. I'm curious, in the aftermath of Tuesday's blue wave, which we saw in the United States, are there any presidential candidates, any lessons for them here? I'm not sure about the lessons from across the Atlantic. What we can see is... The polls, the polls are indicating that there are two winners of what happened. It's Marine Le Pen, who's consolidated and even increased her lead in the polls. And Jean-Luc Mélenchon, who's clearly now in the polls, emerging as her would-be rival for next April, May's presidential election. Until now, Jean-Luc Mélenchon was kind of neck and neck with other more centrist candidates like Édouard Philippe. Former Prime Minister Emmanuel Macron, even Raphael Glucksmann, who was elected by the left to be the candidate of the Socialist Party and its allies. Now Jean-Luc Mélenchon has gained. Why? Because he has been on the streets demonstrating and really he's gaining the support of those who are demonstrating, especially the youth vote. Obviously, it is always a fragile vote because the young people tend not to go to vote as much as the elderly people. But this is what we are seeing right now. It can still change. We don't have the final casting of the presidential race. Obviously, some candidates will withdraw because you only have some 30 candidates. It's absolutely impossible that they will all stay in the race. Anyways, but this is... The lesson we're drawing, and obviously, Marine Le Pen and Jean-Luc Mélenchon are totally opposite, but they're objective allies. They know that if they can squeeze the center and remain the two contenders for the second round of the presidential election, this benefits them. And clearly, the social movements are benefiting them, Jean-Luc Mélenchon because he's supporting Marine Le Pen, because she's saying. Look at the chaos, look at the violence. I'm going to reestablish law and order, not only in talk like the government is doing, but by acting forcefully and so on. And she can just stay and relax and see her polls now reaching the high 30%, a level which she never, ever had before. Ariane. Since the 17th of October and the violence which unfolded, we've had many presidential candidates and the government sort of accusing LFI, the France Unbowed, of instigating the protests, the violence out on the streets. Do you think this in turn has helped propel and get their poll numbers up here in France? It might have. And it was always, you know, it was always too easy to blame LFI. You know, they're not responsible for the grievances. As I said before, it's, you know, it's decades of grievances, really, that has, you know, congregated. And I agree with what was said before, you know, Jean-Luc Mélenchon and LFI in general have been supported, sorry, have supported the student movement right from the start. And also, The grievances, the social and economic grievances tally with his program, tally with what he's said for many years. So it is definitely to his advantage. And I would also say when it comes to Marine Le Pen, that a lot of people are doing the work for her. She doesn't really need to do anything because a lot of the media coverage, not every media outlet. have focused fully on the violence, on all these scenes of chaos that are repeated, you know, on a loop. And that, you know. Again, Talley, with the discourse that she's had for years about how France is a, you know, in deliquescence kind of state, she doesn't mean to do anything. And then you have presidential candidates on the right and the centre who seem to be competing for the most draconian response. So we've heard about state of emergency, sending the army, jamming social media. you know, rescinding citizenship. So they are doing the job for her and they are making her mainstream because some of their proposals are actually harsher than what she wants to do. So for her it's full benefit, she doesn't need to be involved, she doesn't need to say much, except I'm the one who's going to bring order. Ariane and Mark, thank you so much for your analysis.