‘Peruvian pope’ Leo XIV comes home to a country that shaped his life and faith through 'hardship'

They've packed the streets of Peru's capital to welcome the return of Padre Robert. Pope Leo, back in the South American country where the former Robert Prevost, as he was called, served first as missionary and then later as bishop for his first full day back. Remember, Leo holds Peruvian citizenship. He has a full schedule. He's been meeting with bishops. He's already given a statement calling out past abuse within the church And later is due to meet with you some 40,000. Turning out in the central square in Lima, Morgan Eyre has more. It's a joyous homecoming in Lima. Pope Leo XIV is in the Peruvian capital for the final stop of his three-nation South American tour. Before becoming head of the Catholic Church, he was Padre Roberto to the people of Peru after spending 20 years of service there. Born in the U.S., he's a naturalized Peruvian citizen and welcomed back by the thousands lining the streets. He's coming home. He isn't just visiting, he's coming home. He's coming to see his people, his children. The pontiff will travel all around Peru, celebrating mass and giving speeches. It's expected that he will touch on the challenges facing the Andean nation, from political instability to growing crime rates and climate change. May he also help us with the issue of public safety that we face here in the city and throughout the country, for the most part, and also with the El Niño phenomenon that's headed our way from the north. Thank you very much. There's hope that the words of Pope Leo will help prompt a response from those in authority. Some academics say the Catholic Church still enjoys a higher level of credibility than other Peruvian institutions. The Pope, this is the pinnacle of that 12-day visit that he's made to South America, beginning with Uruguay, then Argentina, and now Peru. The Pope Leo, who shrugged off, as he put it, the doubting Thomases regarding his health. He had lung cancer surgery just last month, climbing stairs with ease. There you see, again, these are. Live images that we're seeing from the Peruvian capital, Lima. For more, we can cross to Victor Cazayo, Director of the Department of Philosophical and Theological Studies at Antonio Ruiz de Montoya University. Thank you for being with us here on France 24. Thank you for having me. A great pleasure. He is obviously Chicago-born. Would you say, when you look at his papacy, that Pope Leo is first and foremost a Peruvian? Yes, I would say so in a very Peruvian sense, because here in Peru we like to welcome, adapt and recreate many traditions, fashion, music, culture, I would say, in general. So he's a very Peruvian pope in the sense that he has received many influence, many cultural richness and can have a universal view, I think, but I would also like to point that he has endured here the hardships in these 20 years in Peru. Hyperinflation, political instability, terrorist violence, violence from the state, the pandemics, the El Niño phenomenon here. So I would say that he's a very well-trained Peruvian that's something very rich to bring to the church in a universal point of view. You mentioned what it was like in the 1980s when, again, the former Robert Prevost first went as a missionary. You had the Shining Path guerrilla movement. You had hyperinflation. You had dictatorship. What were your thoughts when you saw him welcomed at the airport? On Wednesday, by the daughter of the former president, Alberto Fujimori, who is now the current head of state, Keiko Fujimori. Well, I think your question very much frames the paradoxes that frame also our country, because it was a political... This is a particular moment, this is a particular visit also from a head of state to another state, but for many people, I must say regrettably, that our country is very much divided. But seeing the Pope there, because he has spoken very clearly about our political problems and corruption, and the differences, not only differences, but polarities, that the Pope can address directly these issues here, but with a calm voice. Claiming that we learn once again to dialogue with one another, even though because it's not only the party, the political party of our current president, but also some of its critics that we tend to polarize and see the other not as someone who has a different opinion, but as an enemy, that it would be better if there's here no more from them. I think that's, I would say from a Christian point of view, a sin, but it's also fragility in our... common and living here in our country. So I think it's not only the president, but the both there that is like a performative way of teaching us how to find once again a way to work together as a country. OK, when when we hear the pope make pointed political statements and we have heard him, we saw him on his tour of Africa make pointed political statements at the long, long time president of Cameroon. We saw it in the most recent leg in Argentina where he called out the inequality under under Javier Milei. Thank you for the delay. It feels like the hosts just sort of grin and bear it. They know this is a bad moment, but then afterwards they can move on. Is it the same for Peru? I would say so also, but maybe in a structural way from the state, because I would like to point out, we have been following also the visit of the Pope to France. We are a very different society. The separation between the state and the church, though formally... It's stated by the Constitution, it's not our current daily lives. So maybe politicians and other figures, even also in our Catholic Church, can say yes, yes, amen to what the Pope says and they go on. But for many people... That they're spiritual, what they find as moral, what they find as humane, comes not from ethical discourses. I am a philosophy teacher, and I know my relevance or irrelevance in this matter for many people, it comes from their faith. So when they listen to the Pope talk about violence, about poverty, write almost two hours ago about a church that has to learn to... Listen to the people and also politicians. I think people, not like talk, they don't just say that they're welcoming the Pope back. They feel like they're once again listening to someone that has lived this directly in our country. So yes, yes, for many people, what the Pope says would be a very hard word. a source to say to our politicians, to the state in our current situation now with the violence, you formerly had talked about this in Peru, we are one of the countries in Latin America that has the more economic growth. And also the most inequality, most violence, daily violence in the streets. So for us, because the church voice and the Pope's voice here sounds very much, I think it would be, it's not realistic to say that we can expect more hope and also demand more responsibility from our politicians. Victor Casario, you frame for us the present day polarization within Peru. Let's go back to that period in the 1980s when, again, this young missionary arrives there. There was a schism at the time within the Catholic Church. The upper clergy was led by conservatives, and he, the then Robert Prévost, met with some of the pioneers of what's called liberation theology, a more egalitarian kind of church. That liberation theology-infused version of Catholicism, is it still with him today? Yes, I would say so, well, directly to answer to your question, yes, and it's not only from the Peruvian church, but in the official documents from the Catholic church around the world, Pope Leo, and not only Pope Leo, but Pope Francis are the preferential option for the poor, for the poor people, the poor indigenous people, the women, the people with... With his capacities we see here in Peru. They are the first, not only for our social health, but for us believers, is where God speaks to us. Jesus Christ is instilled in the cross. That's no more something from some theologians here in Peru, or addressing a very specific situation, but that Catholic Church has explicitly acknowledged that this comes from the gospel and from the more authentic tradition of the Church, that in the late encyclical, Magnificat Humanitatis. Pope Leo remembers, we have not been always faithful in the Catholic Church to this tradition. We have betrayed the poor, the vulnerable, so if you talk about liberation theology, I would say this is now something, a treasure that we have shared, that we have retrieved from the Catholic tradition. But I would also like to say that things are, as always, very complex right now in our ecclesial church landscape and also in the 80s, because there have been bishops and most of the bishops, I would say nuns, religious women, And also laymen and laywomen, that even though maybe they haven't read the Liberation Theology by Gustavo Gutiérrez, but they have been working with the poor. And a very good effort, a very good example, I would say, and something that is very much discussed, contested, and battled here, is the report of the Commission of Truth and Reconciliation in our country. Because there is what you have said. Sometimes the church in very specific situations, especially our last cardinal, our cardinal from the Opus Dei here in Lima, we have closed our doors and not listened to the people that were suffering and were claiming through some charity and solidarity. But also, there were also some people, even bishops that have heard that. And also I work in the Antonio Ruiz Montoya Catholic University, but also in the Catholic, the Pontifical Catholic University. And we have collaborated with this report. So also the Catholic Church has this plurality that today the Holy Father has remembered us. It's not about playing in different fields, but the challenge is to learn how to dialogue again and show our country that it is possible. As you have said in the first part of this report, the Catholic Church, with all its limitations and even sins, and what the Pope has just said a couple of moments ago, When the Catholic Church has protected and looked away from crimes that should have been prosecuted, despite all this, they are the moral institution that is most respected in our country. That shouldn't be a privilege to boast about. Yeah, you talk about the encyclicals, you talk about Pope Leo, like his predecessor Francis, putting the accent on the poor. When he was in France, the contrast was stark between far-right leaders who attended his mass in Paris and their views, which are 180 degrees apart from his when it comes to migration. Is Pope Leo facing an uphill struggle? Is he in danger of losing the church or does he represent the majority? Well, I'm skipping and talking from South America, from Peru. So here, the possibility that the church disappears from the social, political landscape is very little, I would say. But I would also say if the Pope right now, this Pope in the last position, Pope Benedict, don't have a hard time. They don't find it difficult. They are not following what we as Christians acknowledge as our mission. For example, here in Peru, he has worked also with immigrants from Venezuela. And I'm sorry to say that in our country, with so many thousands of people that come from Venezuela, it's common in the street to listen about stories that they're all criminals. They have come to steal our jobs. So in one sense, nothing new under the sun. But in another, we have to remember now, and this is the opportunity here, to remember that this pope has worked with these immigrants. And that has a political cost, yes. Because even though he's a head of state, I understand he talks about issues. From an ethical point of view, we would say as believers, maybe a spiritual point of view, but it has concrete political repercussions on what we do and what we talk about. And the xenophobic remarks in my country, in some political parties, well, they cannot look away from what the Pope is saying. They can endure it and say amen and look away, but once again, I would say I'm hopeful that what the Pope is saying has an echo in these thousands of people that are cheering from him. I hope that they not only listen to our claps and their chants that are very beautiful and very, very, I knew that it will be something big, but not that this big. It's very impressive to be here in Peru right now, in Lima. Yeah, three million people, according to the church, which is a record, showing up this Thursday. I want to thank you so much, Victor Casayo, for joining us from the Peruvian capital. Thank you very much also.