Brooklyn building collapse: Former NYC DOB Commissioner on how investigators find the cause

Rescuers are methodically searching for anybody who may have survived. They're looking in the debris from that deadly building collapse yesterday in Brooklyn. That's right. This morning, officials are working to figure out how this happened. And there are growing concerns about structural stability and the neighboring buildings. Joining us with more insight on this is the former commissioner of the city's Department of Buildings, Robert LaMondre. Thank you so much for being here. When you see those images, what stands out to you? Initially, it's easy to look at the activity that was going on on that day. But we shouldn't just look at that. But essentially there are three pieces in time depending on what was being done. So we know that there was a one-story structure that was demolished. At the end of that, and if it were signed off by the city, which it was in June, they should have done an extreme review of the building next door. It's a fragile building, but it is required by law. In the next phase, we go into Did they do a pre-construction survey before they dig? When they dig, disturbing the soil is certainly something that would be in the focus of the department to look at. So we know there were some excavation efforts that were being done, obviously, to create this newer structure. Could that have created any types of instability in these surrounding buildings that we're seeing? Whenever you move soil, Directly next door to a building, we all know it makes common sense, right? Your foundation is sitting not on a line, but sits on soil that is shared across the property line. And that is what the requirement for earthwork and supportive excavation, which is what they filed and which is what they should have been doing. So the next piece that I would expect the department to do is to look at the sequencing. ...was the contractor... Following the requirements and was the engineer of record involved to make sure that it was being done correctly. So we hear that They wanted to make the building higher It wasn't approved yet would and I think they were appealing that process and that's those are the reports right now Would they have been doing anything with the? Excavation that still could have like, you know Prepared them for a building that was bigger than they had approval for. Yeah, absolutely. If you're going to dig a hole and you're going to build a foundation and your intention is to do a nine-story, well, then you're designing for a nine-story building because that will be done before maybe they got that approval. What the reason was behind why they did it in those two steps, it's unclear to me, but... Yes, they would be building a foundation that could support it because they would not be able to get an approval for a nine-story, makes sense, unless the foundation could handle it. But at the end of the day, I'm not so sure that that is really the focus. The focus is, what were you doing in the hole that day? What did you do in the days, weeks prior? Did you do your surveys? Are there documents? And did you do the right thing? And that's what the city will be looking at. Okay, so we see that building that lost a wall. We can see into the apartments over there. Is that building in danger? Like, what would you do if you were in charge right now? Because, you know, they're all attached homes. Yeah. So I'm sure that the Department of Buildings, with the fire department, during this active scene, You know, right now it's to make sure that they're dealing with victims and debris, but they are probably watching that building with survey equipment and drones to make sure there's no movement to protect the members of the fire department, right? Once that gets done, then they're going to create some sort of a structural stability check of the building next door that did not fall, but the wall is gone, and they're going to figure out if that can stay and how they could manage that through shoring. Shoring is just temporary columns and struts to make sure that it stands. And we've had our reporters, Francis Wang's been reporting it all morning, looking into some of the history with this building. And it looks like in March, things were shut down for inadequate protection of neighboring properties. What could that mean? Well, it could be something as simple as perhaps a construction fence problem or it could be something more important like this issue of when you're doing demolition, you need to protect the building next door. So one of the tricky parts to figure out is, did the action on that day, were there contributing factors that made it worse? In other words, the normal course of business would be fine. But because you've done something differently prior, that could have added, you know, a contributing factor. If you're leading the investigation today, I assume it starts today or as soon as it started last night. I mean, what's the first thing that you're doing? Oh, well... There's two things you're going to be doing. One is certainly supporting the fire department with drawings and assistance and those kinds of things. But if you're sort of in the office, you have a team of people, and what they're doing is they are looking at all of the parties that are involved on this site, and they will be sweeping and inspecting all of those other properties because either this was an accident that could not have been prevented, or there's some other... option that could be there, and they want to make sure that New Yorkers are safe. Let me ask you, there are so many buildings going up in New York City. I see from Midtown to Upper East Side, it's almost like every other block, there's another big building going up, and I know we need affordable housing. But is the New York City Buildings Department, are they equipped to have enough people in there to go around and look at these sites to make sure they're doing what they're supposed to and following the law? This is the question that every commissioner has, is do I have enough boots on the ground? Okay, so there's two ways to handle that. One is to make sure that the people that you have have the tech behind them to direct them and utilizing, there's new ways to focus on bad actors, for example. But then also, you have to remember, New York State... Deputizes, architects and engineers, they are the ones that are designing a building like this. They are the ones that are in charge of that site. So every day that we're not there, there are rules and laws in New York City that most other cities don't have that require people to watch, record and do those things. But then also you have these professionals that it is their livelihood and they take an oath with New York State that they are going to execute. So, and then of course you have insurance companies. Insurance companies want to make sure that the people that they're insuring are doing the right thing. And there's a team of people behind them. So it's not just the department, it's not just the architects and engineers, but you have others like third parties. If I could just ask one more question. You know, right now there are recovery efforts potentially finding bodies, hopefully finding survivors. After that, people are going to want accountability. How quickly could we get any indication of whether or not someone should have seen this coming? It's a good question. You know, in the coming days, I think the department and the investigation will either... Provide something quite quickly, or it may take, remember, if there is fines and stop work orders, that's one thing, but if we're talking about criminal liability, that takes quite a while to make sure that you actually have what you need to prosecute. Thank you so much for coming in and explaining that to us. Robert Lemandry, who's the former New York City Department of Buildings Commissioner. Appreciate it. You bet.