James Harden Is 37 and Struggling: Can He Turn It Around?

All right, last thing for you. You were bullish, my friend, on the Cavaliers before the start of the season. If everybody had gone to bed for the first two weeks, only watched the New York Knicks game on Wednesday night, they would have understood why. The Cavs looked like conference contenders in that game. James Harden goes for 32 points, shoots like 64% from the floor. Donovan Mitchell, a nice, tidy 23. Jarrett Allen has a double-double. A couple of young guys getting... You know, 30-ish points off the bench. The defense makes big stops. Peyton Watson chased down block on Deuce McBride. It's like, whoa, they went to the garden and won. Like, they got a little bit of vengeance for what happened in the conference finals last year. Alas, that was an outlier on what's been going on on the Cavaliers this season. 500 as we're recording this on Friday morning. Statistically, they're just kind of meh. Like, everything's middle of the pack. Like, they're 10th in the NBA in offensive rating, which is kind of good. Like, they're 16th in defensive rating. They're 14th-ish in net rating. Everything, every statistic is just kind of like, eh, they're okay. Meanwhile, James Harden has been a disaster. Like, besides that Knicks game, take that game out. He has been awful. There have been some effort issues. Just do the eye test that you can see going on in Cleveland. Thank you, Vandana. Your thoughts now, are you buying or selling the Cavs still as a conference contender? So let me ask you this. You said the bullish part, but I want to make this clear. I was bullish on them in their regular season and there is, and I'm still going to put that caveat there. So when you say conference contender, are you talking conference of the regular season? Are you talking playoffs? I mean, I, so how I would call conference contender would be, they can win the conference, not in the regular season, win advance to the finals. Yeah. So no. And I, and I actually wasn't in on them before the season either on that. I just don't, I don't think they're built for the playoffs. And I think we've seen it, these, these players, it just, it hasn't worked and I don't know why it would have changed this year. Personally, I still believe, and I, and I was bullish on them in the regular season. I think they are built. I think they have depth when they're healthy and their bench is good. They have some young guys off the bench that I truly still believe they will be a good regular season team. I do, and I totally understand the worry that's out there right now. James Harden has not been good. Peyton Watson just hasn't really impacted them yet. But guess what? First of all, James Harden has had some mini stretches like this where everyone goes, oh, the guy's done. I'll tell you what, get rid of him. And he kind of goes like, oh yeah? And he turns it around. Regular season. Then Peyton Watson is new to this team. It takes guys a second to adjust. He's trying to figure out who he's supposed to be. He has this pressure of this contract, whatever. I just truly believe if Donovan Mitchell is playing and these guys, they have talent on that team. I think they will still be a good regular season team. And not only that, I went into the season saying the East is a gauntlet. I thought that was like really tough. I don't think it's as it has shown so far. This hasn't been as tough, whether it be injuries. I had a coach text me. I had a coach that's in the bottom half of the Eastern Conference field, so to speak, text me and be like, we suck right now, but we're still in it. Yeah, we're still in it. Oh, yeah. Because you think about the teams that we are including in the like the gauntlet and it just hasn't gone well, like Orlando, Charlotte, like there's Indiana. Right. So like at the end of the day, and people would probably point to Cleveland and New York and say they haven't been that great either. So I actually still believe Cleveland will bounce back from this. And yeah, I could, again, I could look stupid at the end of the season where like, Hey, I told you like they really suck, but I just, I, I think they're going to kind of figure it out and they'll be a great, good to great regular season team. I, I, yeah, I'm, I'm just not buying the early struggles and because it is so early. All right. The question though, is what we're seeing from James Harden. Is this permanent or is this a blip? Like James Harden historically has been a phenomenal regular season player. And when he slowed down has often come either in the playoffs, for sure, or late in the regular season when all the minutes he plays and all the bumps he takes catches up to him. We're in week three right now of the regular season. And James Harden's numbers across the board have been awful. He's, I think, still sub-40% from the floor, sub-40% from... Three-point range, scoring numbers are the lowest, I think, since his rookie year. I mean, everything, all these numbers are like, you got to go back to very early Oklahoma City days to see numbers like this from James Harden. Now, Harden has kind of put it on kind of the evolving role he has with this team, which, okay, I'm not so sure that his role's changed that much. I know it has, but like... Still the same, most of the same team from last year, the starters anyway, Peyton Watson is there. They've got some young kids, I guess four new rotation players if you want to say that, but Mobley's there, Allen's there, Mitchell's there, Harden's there. So I don't know if I necessarily buy that. The game he had against the Knicks, like is that, you think that's a catalyst for the revival of the regular season version of James Harden or would you have concerns about Harden who at 37 years old. A lot of miles in those tires, Grant. I saw some stat that he's played more games, regular season and playoffs, than anyone since 2012-2013, including LeBron James. So that speaks to how many miles are on the tires of James Harden. How concerned would you be if you were Kobe Altman, if you were Kenny Atkinson, about what you've seen from James Harden? Well, I mean, they went into this. I'll say this again. I think more concerned would be just that he's if even if he turns it on right now, like what are the chances he still is flying high for his sake in the playoffs? I just like, can you get through a regular season? Sure. Maybe we'll find out the extension. I don't feel good about that. I just I at that James Harden is the greatest businessman in the history. He's the greatest. I have never in my life. Never covered a player that is as good about getting what he wants, both in terms of location and money, than James Harden. James Harden gets what James Harden wants. He's got a three-year deal worth nearly $100 million, and the back end of that deal is a player option. So you can't convince me, Grant, that when year two is up, he's not going to be able to figure out a way to get, like, two extra years from the Cavaliers. He's going to be playing like... He's going to be 46, still getting two-year extension with player options. It's crazy. This guy is a genius. He should go teach at Harvard. Teach at Harvard about how to get what you want by James Harden. Teach a class. Let's just change the name Harvard to Harden. Harden University. Masterful. Master of the universe. I mean, to your point, the one thing that I'd be a little scared of, this isn't a contract year for him. So, you know, he can chill out a little bit. No, I... At the end of the day, this is what I find interesting about players like James Harden or stars like him as they got older, especially in today's NBA. It used to be certain players, when they hit a wall, they're just done. And you can know, you know, when a player hits that wall and you go like, okay, yeah, he's just no longer the guy he used to be, whatever. But I think what we've seen recently, a lot of these high scorers, good players, they can keep on putting up numbers later, but all of a sudden their impact and winning goes away. And I want to give an example of like DeMar DeRozan, for instance, when he's out there, DeMar DeRozan is still unbelievably skilled for the key. Like he can put up 20 a game, but somehow his impact on winning goes away. Right. And I think that's what you look for with the James Harden I'm not saying that's happening right. Well, it's happened so far in the beginning of the season, but as you look forward, he may get his numbers back and stuff, and maybe that'll impact winning. Like he has done his entire career. Let's give credit to James Harden. He was one of the best regular season winners ever. But having said that, the guy's an automatic playoff. Like he gets in the playoffs. That's what he does. Like every team he goes to, because he's a huge part of that. But at some point, what'll end up happening with probably someone like James Harden is you still get numbers and you'll see some triple doubles and new stuff happen, but obviously winning doesn't happen as much. And that's what happens with players like that. It's not the wall of this guy can't play anymore. It's the wall of the impact on winning kind of goes away. We will see if that's right now. Again, I'm really hesitant to say that's right now. I think they will figure it out right now. But at some point that happens and we will see if it's now and then I will, you know, say I was wrong or if it's coming in the next couple of years. You know, this week was kind of the perfect encapsulation of James Harden because Madison Square Garden, national TV, like you can see James Harden getting up for that game. Two days earlier, local TV, Charlotte, Monday night. Not so much. And there was that clip that went viral of Harden just kind of standing in the paint for three possessions, basically. Like, there was two offensive rebounds and a missed three. And he's just doing nothing. He's just hanging out there. A couple of games before that, there was that, you know, clip of him and Kenny Atkinson kind of going back and forth a little bit when Harden was at the free throw line. Like, there are some warning signs here when it comes to Harden. And when he's 37... You start to be a little skeptical that he's going to be able to pull it off. I should say, like, not to put it all on James Harden, because there are some other issues there. Like, they've got to get better overall defensively. Harden and Mitchell, point of attack defense is a problem. Evan Mobley, his numbers are fine. But Grant, like, Evan Mobley's got to be able to create his own shot for that team to succeed in the playoffs. Like, I was watching him kind of try to back down Josh Hart on Wednesday. You've got to be able to back down Josh Hart, man. I know Josh is a strong guy, but Josh is a tweener forward. You're supposed to be a de facto center, and you've got to be able to put your shoulder down and get into the paint against Josh Hart. I like that Mobley's making some shots, but he's got to be able to create his own shot for this team to have success. So I think Harden is the obvious example of a problem in Cleveland, but I think there are some other things they've got to work out before that it can be really successful. Yeah, I agree with you. And at some point, and I've been waiting for Evan Mobley is still so young, but at some point where it was go, when's that leap? When's that leap? And at some point you might have to just say, Evan Mobley is a very good player, a very good player, but he's not going to take that other leap. And so at what point is he just, if you're trying to win a title, probably your second, third best player on your team, right? The guy who's a defensive guy can do this and less pressure on him to be great. All right. That might be eventual, which is an amazing player to have. He's a very, very good player. But to be this superstar top 10 player and stuff, I just, at some point, we may just have to give up on that. Yeah, I think if he was going to take a leap, then we would see Jared Allen move by now. Like, I don't think the Cavs have confidence that Evan Mobley can be a full-time five. Yeah. You know, I mean, Allen is excellent. You know, he can give you a double-double on most nights, If Mobley was ready to assume that role and be your full-time center, I think they could try to find other pieces that might make them a little bit more versatile. You know, part of the problem with Cleveland is like, this is, this is who they are, man. Like this is who they are right now. Like they're hard capped at that first apron. They've got no first round picks that they can trade. Like you can do dollar for dollar deals, but are you going to get something the equivalent of Jared Allen for that $28 million? Are you going to get something the equivalent of Sam Merrill at nine and change? This is what they are. They got Donovan Mitchell signed long-term. Harden is, I don't want to say untradeable, but he kind of is at this point. You're not going to trade Mobley for quarters on the dollar. This is who they are. It's going to be on them internally to try to figure it out and turn it around.