Nicole Dron | Être merveilleux (Témoignage d’EMI)

Hello Nicole Doron. Hello Ying. Welcome to my new personal channel, Etre Vraie. I am particularly honored to be invited. Thank you very much for inviting us. With pleasure, Ying. And you are, we can say, one of the first witnesses for the experience of Marie Nantes. Yes, that's what we say, but there are others, you know, and that's all. Yes, there are many even. Yes, so in fact you experienced this experience of Marie Nantes at the age of 26. Yes, it happened when I was 26, as you said. Following a birth, I had a serious hemorrhage that required a hysterectomy, i.e. the ablation of the uterus. And during this intervention, my heart stopped beating for 45 seconds with flat electrocardiogram. And I, during these 45 seconds, I lived an incredible experience where I found myself out of my body. The first important thing is that I became aware that I was the inhabitant of my body. I remember, but it happened very quickly, I saw giants who traveled the earth. I was told about Atlantis. I was told, and that for me is very important, that God was the force of movement and life. That everything that went in the direction of unity, it was good because here on earth, our civilization has reached a technical point, which is certainly very important in the scale of evolution, but we are in the process of classifying everything. It's good, but on the other hand, beyond this classification, there was unity. And I understood that we had to find this unity in ourselves. At a certain point in my experience, I had the feeling of materializing more and more. And the more I materialized, because we have total knowledge on the other side, the more I understood things. And when I was sure that it was all there was to understand, it amplified. And at the same time, I saw different, more and more beautiful things. Until I found myself in a city of light, gold and precious stones. And that's it, I understood the whole meaning of my life. I have a retrospective on my life. It's still intriguing because all the people who have had the same experience, everyone says that we had total knowledge. And then when we come back to our body, we lose that knowledge. I remember that I was asked if I wanted to stay on the other side or if I wanted to come back. I wanted to come back because I had children, my husband, my husband, etc. While knowing that if I stayed on the other side, well, at the limit, I had them in me. I didn't lose them, I had them in me. But I was told that when I came back, I would forget a lot of things because I had to. So was it necessary? Why was it necessary? I still wonder. Am I no longer able to have this consciousness that I had on the other side on Earth? I know that there are sages who live on Earth and who have reached a level of evolution and consciousness that makes them remember other lives, the why and the how of things. I apologize to the listeners because I am overwhelmed with COVID and it persists. There is no problem. I remember in your book, you say that you are in this light. You have seen a very beautiful being. But in fact, this being was me. You say, this being was me, but me at the end of time, me totally realized. It was a sacred lesson of humility. Yes. Because I saw all the way that I had to go to be what I am at the level of the absolute. That's it. And that's a great philosophy lesson. Because if we are so beautiful, so perfect on the other side, I am often asked the question, but Mrs. Dron, why if we are so beautiful and so perfect, that we come here on Earth, that we live experiences, go through trials, etc. I don't know. But what I want to say to everyone is that it's not just me who is beautiful on the other side. It's every human being in our absolute essence, in what is perfect in us. We are beautiful, we should know it. I would like to say that to children, to young people, instead of talking about sin, etc. To say, hang on to your star. What I want to say to my star is to everything that is beautiful in you, to the absolute in you, because you have all the inner strength to go through all the trials of life. So you felt this being was you. That's it. And this being, I couldn't even say if it was a man or a woman, because I had the impression that it released as much masculine love as feminine love. But I knew it was me. How? I don't know how. I don't know. I extended my arms to him, I said, I want to marry you. And at the same time, I knew that this being was me. I just wanted to become what I am again in eternity. I don't know, in eternity, but in the beginning of creation, somewhere. It's always wonderful what we are. So for you, this being was you, your real you. That's it, my real me, exactly. You could feel that, in fact, it's your origin. It was my origin, my essence, my essence, the perfection of myself. Okay. Because there is also this sentence you said, just the fall. At the same time, I understood that if I could live from here, at the tip of my soul, I am already this perfection. That's it, I am already that. That is to say, when you say the tip of my soul, that is to say, if our spirituality, if we are at the highest level, we are connected to our… That's it, for me, that's it. The tip of my soul is this perfection of ourselves. Okay. And it's this meeting that made you understand the meaning of your life or the… How to say? What is the message you… Shine all the love that is in you. It's also the question that was the most important for me in my life, which was asked to me by, I always say, a being that our heart knows. He didn't introduce himself. He didn't say, I am the Christ, Buddha, Mahomet, or such and such… No, he didn't say that. But I believe that each being recognizes who he is, that's all. He asked me, how did you love? What did you do for others? And when he asked me this question, I saw, I had the vision, certainly symbolic, of the whole Earth, of all humanity, who had their arms raised to the sky, and it was the arms of this humanity that implored. And I felt in me all the suffering of humanity. One day, even if we are happy one day, we can become unhappy the next day. I felt it. What did you do for them? The older I got, the deeper it got. One day, I was reading a book by Emerson, which said something like that. To do all the good that exists in the human being, to help him grow in all aspects of his being. Not only in each human being, but in everything around us. Because everything lives, the whole creation lives. So, at the limit, to look at what is eternal, divine, in everything. When I arrived in this light, I found myself in a very beautiful garden. And there, for me, I understood the sacred of life. Because here, at home, if I look at a bunch of herbs, well, there is the green color, there is the shape, it's beautiful, a flower is beautiful. And there, it was sublimated, because I saw the molecules of life that vibrated inside everything. The colors were purer, brighter. I even saw colors that could be called pastel on earth. But I have no equivalence to say that it looks like apricot, for example. No equivalence. They were other colors too. And I remember, in this very beautiful garden, I sat down by a stream. And it was water, but it was the light of water. If I looked at the sounds of the water, the clatter of the water, well, at the same time, they were sounds, but they were colors. Everything was one, in a way. And I was amazed, because I didn't feel more important than a bunch of herbs, than a note of music, than a color. I felt like I was part of the life that circulates in all this. We are so identified with our body, our thoughts, our emotions, with what we want, what we don't want, etc. In short, we are so identified with that, we are firmly convinced that it is us and that this is life. But thanks to such an experience, which is a spiritual experience, and that we don't have to die to do it, of course, I was able to realize that we are infinitely, infinitely bigger than we can imagine. The important thing is to become aware of who we are. So, who are you? Who are you? I am not Nicole Dron. I am the spiritual being. I am this spark of life and love that is in me. And it's true that it takes time. It starts like this. Who am I? What did I come to do on earth? Why am I here? Why is there so much misery in the world, so much suffering? Can we help people to help themselves not to suffer anymore? Is there something in me that always reproduces these sufferings? A state of thought, a state of being. And then we try to understand each other as we go. Sometimes it goes through psychology, quite simply. And then we realize that it's good to get to know our ego a little bit, maybe to make our ego a little bit comfortable, but it doesn't lead to deliverance. And to get to deliverance, I believe that you have to start a real work of self-knowledge. And so you say, you are not Nicole Dron. That is to say, you are a spirit that comes from much higher, which is embodied in Nicole's body, in her clothes. Yes, exactly. But you have understood that the most important life, the key to our life, the reason for being on earth, is to love. We have just learned to love. But to really love, how is it so difficult? For most people who will listen to me, for example, to love is to love in relation to earthly consciousness. It is, for example, with earthly feelings. For example, if I say to my husband, I love you, symbolically it is as if I were putting my heart in my hand, I extend my heart to him, I extend my other hand to have as much. Of course I caricature, but I mean that we stay in the feeling. And the feeling is not the state of love that I experienced on the other side. And this state of love, I know that we can only experience it when we are rid of everything I call ego, but I will say what I put behind the word ego. Obviously egoism, but also pride, but also avarice, but also the desire to be known, but also the desire to dominate, all that. All that somehow keeps us enslaved. It prevents us from seeing the wonderful being that we are, and that this being is full of love. So this love and this knowledge at this level, which I call wisdom, cannot prostitute itself with what we call earthly love. Earthly love, even the most beautiful. And maybe we have to go through this earthly love, because it allows us to understand each other. But even the most beautiful, it is always still a little bit colored with egoism, jealousy, this and that. And if we manage to free ourselves a little bit from all this egoism, this jealousy, this possessiveness, we can slowly be able to imagine what love is, which is not a feeling, but which is a state. And finally, when we enter this love on the other side, we no longer need love, we are love. That is to say, for people to understand. Yes, yes. You can describe precisely what this state of fullness is. Imagine that you become aware, from one day to the next, that before you lived completely in a prison, without realizing it, because you are, for example, subjected to jealousy, to judgment, to this and that. Even in love, in many things of love, it does not suit you, because you would like, for example, to appropriate all the love for you. Imagine that all of a sudden, you are out of this cage, you are no longer in this prison. You breathe a lot. And there you are in a love that no longer depends on you. How to say that? This love no longer depends on you, it no longer needs the other to exist, if you will. Often we love someone, but what we love in the person, for example, when I talk about love, what we love in the person is what drives you, how much he loves you. In the end, we realize that in love we seek a lot, how to say that? It's not unconditional. That's it. We seek to be loved, it's always self, self, self, somewhere. That's it. And on the other hand, this love is like the sun. The sun loves everything. And we become this sun. And we are filled with this love. We are filled with that. And at the same time, it's life. Love is not just love, it's life, it's knowledge, it's fullness. I can't say it any other way, Yim. It's really a total freedom, actually. Yes, yes, yes. It's the deliverance, as you say. It's a deliverance. And I think we can't reach that quality. Of course, there must be levels in all this. But we can only reach that fullness when the ego, which is also necessary, but when we are no longer trapped by the ego, by attachment. We can obviously love someone very, very strongly. It's wonderful. We experience this feeling of love, but in the end we are afraid of losing it. For me, it creates attachment. And this fear, this attachment, it will stain everything. It will prevent us from loving in all freedom. It corresponds to the release, the detachment, the confidence in life, the confidence that we will always be loved. Because sometimes it's the fear of not being loved that makes us cling to the other. But here, it goes with everything. It's the hope, the confidence. I would like to tell you that according to Buddhism and Taoism, in order to have true freedom and true happiness, you have to know how to detach yourself from the renown, the fame and the feelings. So you have the same understanding. Of course, of course. But I think that there is only one way, you know, for the whole Earth. We can talk about Buddhism, Taoism, Hinduism, Christianity, this and that. Maybe in the external aspect of things, in the dong, maybe it differs. But the heart of everything is exactly the same. The way is the same for everyone. How do you free yourself from all the traps that prevent you from accessing this love, this freedom in you? How do you make life grow in you and in others? To make life grow in me is, as I said, the dusting off of everything that is not this divine being that is me. Earlier we said that in order to arrive, to reach this state of fullness, you have to detach yourself from everything, materially, from everything. All the attachments that you can have. That's right. Attachments don't mean love. Because here on Earth, we are afraid. Because people who can hear, Oh yes, you shouldn't love anymore. No, that's not attachment. Attachment is what is not pure yet in us. What makes us dependent. What makes us dependent on the love we can have from a couple, on the love we can have from our children. It's beautiful. Obviously, it's not a question of detaching ourselves from the love we have for dear ones. But it's to detach ourselves, for example, when we have children, from the need to appropriate these children for ourselves. One day, when the children leave us, they make their lives, they are adults. And it is precisely in the way that we have raised them that we should be happy, that when they leave us, they can assume for themselves. They will always have this love that we have for them. But it will not be a love that will want to keep them only for us. It will be a love for them to be happy. Earlier, you also asked the question, why are there so many sufferings in this world? Do you think it is above all this selfishness? I don't know, I don't have the answer to everything. Or the origin of all these sufferings, what is it? The origin, I don't know the origin. For me, it is only my personal opinion. I think we came to Earth, we may have needed to experiment, we may have needed to know each other, etc. We forgot who we are. And then, finally, we make ourselves as a force, once identity, etc. By coming and returning to Earth, we may realize things that are not ours. We take habits that are not really ours. We lock ourselves in density. And then one day, it is impossible, we can no longer breathe. It is impossible to live, because this density suffocates us. And we need to get our heads out of the water that day. And that day, we are saved. Because when we can't take it anymore, the sufferings that we have generated ourselves, we call for help. And that is where we can come and help us. But the real origin of suffering, of trials, etc., apart from this selfishness in us, if there is an even higher origin, I don't know it. And for you, because in your book you said, It helped me to show that I would have a lot of trials. A lot of trials and sufferings. In time, I stayed to live on Earth. I asked the why of these trials, and I was told that I had accepted them before I was born. Because thanks to them, I would grow up. Yes, that's exactly it. I accepted, I understood in this state. When I was in the City of Light, I was shown that when I would return to my body, what would happen to me until the end of my days. And it's true that I cried a lot of times. I said to myself, but what have I done to God to deserve all these trials? I was told that I had accepted them before I was born, because through them I would grow up. And I asked to be given all that was left for me to live in other lives, because I was shown that there was only one life. Because I understood that for me, Earth was hell, and I didn't want to go back to hell. And I wanted to live in a single life all the experiences that were useful for me to get out of that. And I was told that they couldn't give me more than my shoulders could bear. But when I was... You told me earlier that I had met what we call the Higher Self. And there, how can I say this? There I also realized that... Because when I met this being who was me, and that I only had one desire to melt into him, I understood that I had what we call the vision of the Eagle. I mean that I was high enough to see why. Why do we live such a thing at such a moment of our existence, in such a dimension, etc. I understood that intimately. And so, I would have accepted to live a whole life, for example, in a wheelchair, to have a terrible ordeal, I would have accepted it. Because I saw through this ordeal that it was only an experience from the divine point of view. We qualify it as an ordeal because we suffer, but it is only an experience. Well, I saw that by living this experience, that it would develop in me, maybe tolerance, more love, more openness, more understanding, etc. And that even such an experience can make all the people around me evolve. Because they are obliged, they are obliged to develop their love and their patience, etc. And I understood that these were not experiences that were necessarily given to us because we would deserve it. For example, that we would have a karma. We can, of course, in a life, and certainly it happens a lot, we come with good things that we have done, but bad things, what we call karma, for me. And so, of course, there are these things. But I am convinced that there is not only karma. I am convinced that a certain level of our soul, of what is most beautiful in us, we accept. But you have to get to a certain level. We accept things like that to go faster, to get home faster. OK, it's really to go back to our origin. That's it. It's a necessary step. That's it. It's a little bit like if we wanted to skip a class when we go to school. We accept to go faster, to work more, maybe to have more difficult tests, more difficult experiments, which are not necessarily punitive. But it's just because, that's it. And on earth, we forgot that our soul, well, it may have signed a contract to go faster. We forget it on earth. And it seems very hard, hard, hard to us. OK, OK. So you have, we can say, you have really seen, in fact, in other dimensions, through your experience, that all these trials, all these sufferings, can really make us go home faster. Faster. And really become someone better. Exactly. That's it. And even for others, in fact, it creates consequences. Yes, because our life is related to everything. That's it. OK. That's it. I'm not saying it's the same for everyone. I don't know. But I understood that. I understand that when we come to earth, maybe we sign contracts, in quotes, of course, with our husband, our children, our parents. That's it. Well, you see, I play that role. And then that role, well, it will allow me, etc., etc., etc. We come to love, to help each other. So there really is a reason we are here. Ah, there is a reason. For me, life is sacred. And even if I understand, because, well, unfortunately, I have a brother who died these days, and I don't judge, I'm absolutely not in the judgment, especially since it was a very good case. He just couldn't suffer anymore. But I know that life is sacred because we came, we don't remember, that's the problem. At least our earthly consciousness doesn't remember. And maybe that's why prayer, meditation, all of that is important, to maybe build the bridge between our earthly consciousness and this great consciousness, which makes us really remember why we came. OK. And in that sense, can we say that the principle of the universe is reversed in relation to the human principle? Because on earth, if we are sober, if we are in the trials, if we are not happy, if we are not good, if we don't see... Exactly. But in fact, it's a good thing. Yes, that is to say, everything that we do is for our own good. Everything that we do is for our own good. We don't know it. Everything that we do is for our own good. But I don't mean that all trials are necessary. I think they are there precisely so that we become aware that we could maybe live differently and not be attracted to all of that. But everything is necessary. Everything we live is necessary. That is to say, precisely that is interesting because often when we are in trials, when we are in suffering, it can happen to us, that is to say, we are darkened in this experience. Of course. In depression and everything. In fact, if we know that in reality, it can accomplish us, it can make us a better version of ourselves. That's it. Of course, when everyone, one day or another, we all go through trials that put us on our knees. That's obvious. So, well, we have two possibilities. I think it's a great sage who said, Paul Brunton, that's how we end our lives, quite simply. That's it. Or else, well, we try to understand why this happens to us. We try to know ourselves better, etc. And then, as we go along, as we get rid of all the things that overwhelm us, we fill ourselves with this light, with this love. And that's how we get up too. I think that as long as we are in the ego, we are under the law of destiny. That's it. Because it's a bit like when we come into the world, we are a musical note, we are an energy, we are a frequency. And we attract all the frequencies that correspond to us. Which can be considered as destiny. That's it. Precisely, in fact. We're just going to develop a bit. Because for people who don't know your story, already during this experience, you saw your future. Yes. You saw a part of the future. That's why you say destiny. That is, for you, everyone has their own destiny. Because you saw certain futures of your family, even of your environment. Even of humanity. That's it. So you saw, there are things that really happened. Realized, we can say. Yes, exactly. The future is realized. And you can already tell us the future you saw in your environment. Yes, well, in the heart of the experience, for example, I saw the future. And I was told that three people from my family would leave us. When they would leave us, it would be almost all three at the same time. Two to three weeks break. That's it. I didn't know who would leave first, second, third. I had forgotten. But it's true that on January 27, 1981, on Tuesday, my father-in-law died. Three weeks later, on Tuesday, my grandmother leaves us. And at the end of the next year, it was my mother-in-law. I admit that my husband told me that he needed concrete things like that. My husband, I knew very well that I had always known what I had experienced. I didn't need reassurance, if you want, from others to know what I had experienced. But my husband needed concrete proof like that. So that is to say, in fact, the destiny that you saw of the people, it is indeed destiny. Certain things cannot be changed. There are things that cannot be changed. I was also very challenged by my brother when I woke up from this experience. I was still in the experience, but I woke up and I said to myself, no, I beg you, my God, not that, not that, not that. Because they showed me that one of my brothers, who was 19 years old at the time, that he would end his stay. They showed me that and I always said to myself, I needed to protect myself from this suffering. It's terrible. And I said to myself, if they showed it to me, it's maybe because it will be possible if one day he goes through a difficult ordeal, maybe it's so that we can prevent that. And it made me feel good to think that. But it did not prevent me that when, for example, we were all in the family, that he was there, my parents, that I saw everyone laughing, that we were happy. I had this look, I looked, I said to myself, please, I beg you, since it's not happening. And that, I kept it all the time, in me. I could not say that to my parents. I could not say, you know, my, his name is Michel, my brother, you know, mom, I saw that, or dad, I saw that on the other side. Automatically, I would have ruined their life. I could not tell them that. So I kept that. And then, unfortunately, well, following a, how, his work, so he was a computer engineer, but his, his, his company, it stopped. He had problems with couples, etc., etc. So, I remember that, for six months, every day, he lived in Paris, every day, he called us. We held each other by the arm, we held each other by the arm. Despite everything, I thought that, we would get to, he would get out of there. But no, but no, but, and that's why, there were certain things that, there was certainly a basic psychological problem, too. That's it. And as long as the problem is not solved, well, that's it, it leads to this situation. It's, it's really us who can change our destiny. It's true. Even others help us, but it's not them. That's it. There is, that's why there was the yes and the no. That's it. It's difficult to change a destiny. We can't change it if we don't have, if we don't evolve. It's our, how do you call it? Maybe, maybe, maybe in China you have a word to say it. It's our inner evolution, it's our awareness of who we are that makes us change the texture of our, of our energy, of our body, of our consciousness and that's what creates a new man and that's what creates a new destiny. So it's, in fact, first of all, we want to change. It's this will to be better Yes. of oneself. Yes. If we don't have the will to change, if we decide to choose another path, everything is possible. Everything is possible. With the help we can get from God or other spiritual beings much more advanced than us, etc., of course it's possible. We are here for that. So that's already what you understood through your experience. Yes. That is to say, we have our destiny but it's possible to change if we make efforts in this spiritual path. Yes. It's possible to change this spiritual path. Yes. That's it. You understood that. Absolutely. And how? Through what? I don't know. But I can't tell you how. It's obvious but it's capital! Why? Because during my experience I was no longer in my earthly consciousness. I was in this universal, divine consciousness. I don't know how to put it, cosmic consciousness. I was in this consciousness and it was obvious that I was in this universal, It's an evidence, it's an evidence, because what survives death is not our cells. Of course, our body is not just a body of atoms, of cells, it's much thinner than that. It's a body of energy, of consciousness. So there is a part, of course, that will return roughly to Earth, but this part of energy, of consciousness, it survives. It's another consciousness than our conscious. It's much thinner, more subtle. We return to the cosmic consciousness. We are no longer locked in the earthly consciousness. Okay. So... Everything opens up. Everything opens up. The scales fall out of our eyes. So the real meaning of life is precisely to make this journey to... Yes, yes, yes. I was told in the experience that I lived there, they showed me that we were in 1968, that we had a great technology, but not much consciousness or fraternity. What to say now? The technology now, with artificial intelligence, transhumanism and all that, somehow it's good, if we use this intelligence in favor of the human. When I say human, I mean with a capital H. It's a human being, totally human. Totally human, for me, it's not just being intelligent. There is a higher energy than intelligence, which is this divine energy. Well, this, as it is in the service of the human, it's wonderful. But if we use this artificial intelligence for personal gain, for whatever we want, we go straight into the wall. And that's what they showed me. They showed me that in 1968, we were at the crossroads, and that everything depended on life on Earth. It depended only on our own ability to wake up. To wake up is not just to understand things intellectually. No, to wake up is to change plans, dimensions. From the human consciousness, to realize that there is something else that is our true being. That's it. If we don't do this transfer individually and collectively, unfortunately, I don't think we can survive. And according to you, our true being, what is it? It's our... It's what we are when we get rid of the ego. I always come back to the same thing. Our true being is life. It's the life we feel. In every possible way. It's love. It's wisdom. It's all of that. And maybe even more than that. For me, this is really an important awakening, because our society is based on selfishness. Yes, on profit, on domination, on recognition. Me, me, me, me, me. That's it. That is to say, if we really want to be good, to really find our well-being, even for the whole universe, we have to change radically. That's it. We have to open up. On the other side, Ying, you see, for example, when I came back, at the end of the experience, when I came back to my body, I went through my head, and I came back to myself. The drama of existence. That was it for me. Coming back to my body. Whereas for the majority of people, ah, she came back to her body, she came back to life, bravo, you're here. But for me, coming back to my body, it was the world upside down, as you said earlier. My body was like a coffin. I was locked up in myself, in my body. The feeling of being myself and everything at the same time was over. It was over. On the other hand, I never lost the feeling of being myself, but I found myself in the universe. I was everything. I was aware of everything. And I came back, squarely, in a little box like that. And then the feeling of being united to life was over. On the other hand, I was me, but I was you at the same time. I was mister, I was… That's it. So the notion of being myself grew in the universe. So when you come back like that, in your body, it's the world upside down. You come back like that in yourself. The other, you, it's not me. At the limit, I have a lot of affection for you, Ying, but at the limit, I could find myself in front of someone who is hostile to me, etc. To feel hostility, simply… You see, it's not life, it's quite the opposite. Yes, that's true. And so, that is to say, if we can really give up our ego, we can really find, in this state of fullness, in fact, we can have a lot more wisdom, freedom, well-being. In fact, it's the origin of all happiness. Yes, because we wish in this state as much happiness, fullness, for the other than for ourselves. So, there is not everything. We are no longer limited to ourselves. We become everything, so we wish for all happiness. That's it. So, for you, when you have really lived, yes, is it easier to give up, that is to say, to transform selfishness into altruism? It's not easy at all. We say altruism, yes, altruism, yes, yes. OK, so it's not easy anyway. Well, of course not, it's not easy. As far as I'm concerned, maybe for someone else it would be easier, but that's why I always tell people, because you know, people tend to put a halo of holiness around my face, because I was on the other side. But no, not at all. Well, I want to say that I am a witness of light, because it's true, I saw the light, it transformed me, but I am really aware that when I really die, the day of my death, then of course I will see the light again, of course I will understand the meaning of my life, what was good, what I didn't understand, what I didn't do well, etc. I will understand all that, but to stay in the light, I have to become light myself. You see, you see a bottle of water, it is very pure. If you put dirt in it, well, you can't do it anymore. Well, that's where we understand that we have a long way to go to become light. And I, like the others, I have the same path. And I, like the others, it's just as difficult. OK. And do you have examples of some people who changed their destiny? People who changed their destiny? Yes. That is to say, he took this step, he said, we say free will, that is to say, he said, I will choose this path, I will precisely detach myself from certain things that are in my old path, I will detach myself from that, I will change the environment, I will change my state of mind so that I can... It happens, I heard some people, but I don't remember the names, but it makes me think of a lady named Anita Mordjani, a lady who lived, like me, this experience. And she had lymphatic cancer, at the last degree. She only had a few minutes left, a few hours to live, that was all. And in the experience that she lived, she realized that she had made her cancer, and she realized that it was also because when she was young, she always wanted to please her entourage. She didn't listen to herself. So there was something behind it, you see. And after having lived this experience, she was totally healed. And it was her... her way of being and her way of thinking changed completely. That is to say, our way of thinking really can change things? Yes, yes, because the way of thinking, in the end, it is... it is not that it is dependent, but it is connected to some... to a fullness, to what we are deeply. If what we are deeply is totally fulfilled, the thought changes, it becomes what we are, automatically. And so it creates... it creates harmony in everything, in the body and elsewhere. And you, in your book, you said that our thoughts and selfish, violent or aggressive emotions are the cause of a lot of misery. Yes, yes. How did you know that, in fact? I knew that because... it is obvious, on the other hand, because we ourselves, we are everything. We are connected to everything. We are... we are a vibration. We are energy. But for the... how to say... for the people who believe in science, for them, it is... Yes, but for them, okay. I am not a scientist. And you, you really saw, in other dimensions, that our thoughts and emotions can create consequences. Yes, yes. But I also remember when I came back into my body, many years later, I had been invited once in a big congress. It was Hypothesis Gaia, the Earth is a living being. It was in Clermont-Ferrand. And I was very surprised because I did not expect to hear about it like that. There was a physicist, I do not remember the name, this physicist, who himself said that we are all fields of energy. That our Earth, our Mother Earth, is not just a planet that we can absolutely, if you want, like a lemon pressed for... There you go. She also has a consciousness, an energy. We are on this Earth. But we, each person, we are an energy. And each human being, it creates a vortex, I do not know how, an egregore of energy. And if the totality of human energies emits, if you want, harmony, kindness, generosity, the Earth is imbued with that. And if, on the contrary, we are bellicose, we are in the revolt, we are in this and that, and there you go, our Earth reacts to that. And it was not necessary, already, it was in 1990-91, and already, he said that, for example, volcanic eruptions, earthquakes, were linked to our inner state, our state of being. It goes far, doesn't it? That is to say, really, our state of thinking and our emotions can have an impact on ourselves and also on our environment. Exactly. And when we know that, we are more inclined, each of us, to pay attention to our thoughts. But when I speak of the origin of thoughts, for me, it is something else, it is, all of a sudden, why am I still angry today? Why? I will remind you all the time, it was a very beautiful day, in April, the children were teenagers, they were at home, I woke up in the morning, the sun was shining, it was going to be a perfect day. I was really in a beautiful energy. My children woke up, and you know what teenagers are like, my daughter goes down the stairs, my son behind, he starts to hit his sister, then both of them go down quickly, and I wait for them at the bottom of the stairs, in the hospital, saying, that's it, you are still angry. And then, all of a sudden, I reacted, that's it, you have to leave, my daughter. And it took me years to try to distance myself from what is inside of me, if I am still angry, or if I still feel judgment, or resentment, or everything we can live. What is inside of me? And then I realize, by doing this, well, we distance ourselves from the event. Okay. That is to say, we have to make this effort, that is to say, to analyze our every thought. Exactly. And then we realize, when we say, what is inside of me? Well, finally, we look at ourselves to live. And the person who says, what is inside of me? She is no longer that, she is no longer angry, she is no longer judgmental. And that's it. That's why it's a long-term work, it's necessary. And it allows us, very slowly, to distance ourselves from things. Exactly. This paragraph, I would like to quote, it's, you say, I could see the lies and the mischief of people, their cheating, but with time, I felt towards them both more detachment and also more compassion. I no longer felt attracted to them. I understood that their egoistic behavior was at the origin of their suffering. And I was no longer in judgment. That's true. I remember, my mother always told me, you, with you, my daughter, everyone is good, everyone is nice. That's it. And it annoyed me a little bit, you see, when she told me that. I didn't tell her, but no, because I saw beings as they are. Everyone is not beautiful, everyone is not nice, that's it. But I didn't, I was no longer in reactivity. Because sometimes, we're going to make a mess, we're not going to be nice to you. Well, he shows me this, paf, we're going to give it back to him, otherwise, but that's it. No, I realized who people were, but I didn't need to answer them anymore. I knew very well, somewhere, often someone who hurts another person, is a person who is also suffering. I realized, I realized that it was because she herself was suffering that she was doing that. So I didn't need to answer. And then, for me now, each being is becoming. Often, people, well, when they are disappointed by someone who has hurt them, these people tend to leave this person all the time in the same place, if you will, in the same place, at the same time that she hurt them. Well, this person, she is not credible, she is mean, she did this to us, that. It's like that for a lifetime. Well, I know very well that we evolve, everyone, one day or another, we will evolve. It's not that I'm in complacency. It's not that I accept everything, that I can understand, but I'm not necessarily in complacency. But I'm no longer in judgment. But how did you find this compassion towards people? That is to say, you are no longer, even if he hurts you, but you think first, in fact, he suffers too. Yes, I can't tell you, it's done on its own. It's with time. It's with time, it's, maybe, maybe also that when we free ourselves a little from the ego, I'm not saying that I got to the end, I see very well how I am, but maybe also that we fill ourselves with more love. Maybe that too. And then, and then the fact on the other side of being me and everything at the same time, it changes the look that we can have on life. That's it. And your definition for compassion, I like it a lot. Can you give us this definition of compassion again? I don't know what you mean by that. I don't know what you mean by that. I don't know what you mean by that. I don't know what you mean. In fact, you said, I'm going to tell you, you said, true compassion does not consist of being nice or kind towards you and apologizing for everything. It consists of awakening the living forces that are sleeping in you. True compassion pats your butt Exactly. And brings to light what you are to improve yourself. The true love is the love of others and the love of others is the love of others. The true love is a force that is built. Exactly. It's like often people who are on a path, they dream of meeting one day a spiritual master. And of course I understand it perfectly, but in the hope that this spiritual master will caress your back and say it's good, you worked well. But that's not a spiritual master. A spiritual master is the one who will tell you what is wrong with you, what is still blocking you, how to overcome certain obstacles. But he will tell you what you need and he will give you a kick in the back to help you move forward. Because it's like a mother. A mother, if you want, there are several ways to love a child. We will fill him with chocolate, cakes, confectionery because we love him so much. It's normal to put ointment on him, but sometimes you have to cut to remove the pus that is inside. When you really love someone, I noticed in the experience that I had lived, I lived love, an infinite love, but a strong love, a love that is able to straighten us up, to awaken the forces that live in us, to teach us to become what we are. Before we conclude our interview, 55 years after your EMI experience, what is your message of hope? Each of us can accomplish this purification or inner transformation. Absolutely. We can achieve what we want and we can achieve what we want and we can achieve what we want and we can achieve what we want and we can achieve what we want Absolutely. We can All you need is not to let yourself always be enveloped by life, by our life and by our earthly consciousness. To be involved with work, with sleep Life does not limit itself to these things. If we take a step back, if we look for who we really are, we would put ourselves in a lot of gratitude, of fullness, etc. We realize that it is not necessarily the fact of accumulating a lot of things, the fact of having. When I talk about having, it is obviously material things, but it can also be intellectual things, and even spiritual, because there is a lot of selfishness in a lot of things too. Well, happiness is simple, it is to love. It is really to love, to love in wisdom. In the end, I think we should return to simplicity in life. Thank you very much, Nicole. Thank you, Ying.