When Everything Falls Apart: Love, Loss, Judgment, and Starting Over

Most people think personal growth comes from success. But the truth is, the deepest transformation often happens when everything familiar is stripped away. Your home, your relationship, your identity, even the life you thought you were building. I'm your host, Edna White, and this is Keeping It Real On Purpose, where we talk about the real moments that shape who we become. Today, I'm joined by Helen Glanville, CEO of Second Chance SA, whose life changed through loss, judgment, and rebuilding from the ground up. Welcome to the show. Thank you. Greetings from Australia. All right. So Helen, before we get into the deeper part of your story, give us a short picture of who you are today and the work you do with Second Chance SA. Well, 10 years ago, my husband and I founded Second Chance SA. Essentially, it's a charity for people impacted by the criminal justice system. People who are often rejected, unwanted, and in particular, the children. The children who are, in fact, the hidden or invisible victims of crime. Because the domino impact on the family is huge when a parent is incarcerated. That was our calling for most of our married life, prior to the 10 years of Second Chance, as we were with another organisation for 20 years. It really grew as a result of my husband's own compassion and empathy. However, he experienced imprisonment himself and it impacted. He saw the impact on his own children. I have, in fact, since founding that organisation, I have retired. And my husband passed four years ago. So I am now a widow. And I am talking about my life, how it went through many opportunities for self-development. And I actually have a phrase that says that life is a character development programme. I like that, that I like. Okay, you said loving someone with a complicated past forced you to face your own fear of judgement. Why do people judge those relationships so harshly? And what does that reveal about our own fears? Well, it's like anything, it's the unknown. I had the opportunity of getting to know my husband against all the odds, against all the opposition. I think that when you fall deeply in love, it covers a multitude of opposition. And so we just carried on. We were two strong, independent thinkers. I think that that made a difference. I was never really a people pleaser. I was never really someone who went with the crowd. I had my own thoughts and I fell in love with a man who was trained in independent thinking. He was a lawyer. And I think that when you have a strong mind and you can do critical thinking and weigh up the pros and the cons and then allow your heart to lead you, I think that's where and how you make life's big decisions. That's good. That's great. Many people walk away when life gets complicated. What made you stay? And what did that decision cost you emotionally and socially? I stayed because of the power of love. I also have a sense of loyalty. I knew there was a hope for our future. I knew that together we could make a difference. And I think we should, in many cases, take the long view and not the short view. I think this world has trained us to want to have immediate gratification. Everything has to happen now. I want it now. And quite frankly, one of the drivers for crime is being impetuous. So a lot of people, especially guys, they don't think, they don't have extended education and they make impulsive, impetuous decisions because they're with the wrong crowd and they suddenly decide, yes, I'll drive the getaway car. But they haven't thought through the long-term implications of that decision. So if we're impetuous with our daily decision-making, we have a problem because we haven't probably counted the cost. Yeah. What did it cost you emotionally to do that? Well, we eloped while my husband was in prison. Emotionally, that was the best day of my life. I didn't want my family there because they opposed us. They were hostile. My husband was 20 years older. He had a criminal record. He was penniless. He had been a womanizer. So many. He ticked all the wrong boxes. Okay. But emotionally, I was strong. I really wanted to proceed with this relationship and in the long run, it was the best thing that we did. There was a hiccup along the way where I was weary. I think that when you're in your early 20s, you can be weary of the pressure and holding on and waiting and waiting and waiting. But when he was out, we got together and we made a difference. And that's what I wanted to achieve and that's what we did achieve. I think too, a lot of times in this world and probably other worlds, we misconstrue the word love as like an emotion instead of a dedication or a commitment. And that's something that you build on all the time. And I think that's where we get the instant gratification. Or if I'm with somebody who doesn't satisfy me or doesn't tick those boxes that everybody else says, then we get objectionable about a lot of those things. But I think not knowing and not having loyalty too, and that's a great important attribute of yours is having that loyalty to understand this person, loyalty to go through and see the end of it. A lot of us, when we fall in love, we see the right now and then we don't really see the end go. We don't see that part. Well, when you're in very unnatural conditions such as separation by imprisonment, you have to give a fair go. You have to wait for them to get out to make a difference. But unfortunately, a lot of guys, they're in prison. They may not have as long a sentence as my husband did, but invariably women do give up and the guys inside get that Dear John letter. And the Dear John letter being, I found someone else. I was so committed, I didn't want to find anyone else. But yeah, I made a commitment. But you've got to understand too, not everyone gets married while someone's in prison. He had one month day leave and we got all the right permissions to have that ceremony go ahead. And it was important not to marry before he went to prison because the media, he was such a hot topic for the media. He didn't want me to be subjected to media scrutiny. And so by waiting three years, that actually avoided, and it no longer was his home. It had been. Okay, okay. You have shared that you lost your home in the bushfires and then later your husband. When life strips away everything familiar, what happens to your identity? Well, I think in this life, it's very important that we don't attach our identity to things. We are living in a material world. Yes, we had a lifestyle that was beautiful. It was 32 years in the Adelaide Hills. It was a lifestyle. It wasn't just a home. We had 25 acres. We raised cattle on weekends. We looked after those cattle. We built our own home. We raised two sons in that home. We were commuters. It was about a 45 minute trip from our home down to the city for education and for work. I think, however, as much as it pained us to lose it all, our age and my husband's health was probably a blessing in disguise, even though we didn't realise it at the time. Right, right. I had my youngest son was in India at the time. This is five days before Christmas. And he phoned me and he said, Mum, you may not want to hear this, but I have a feeling that this is going to be a turning point for good. And I have to say, looking back, it was. You can start again. As much as my husband's history was all destroyed, family ornaments and things that were handed down, like a French marble clock, all those little things that we think are important. But we started again. We had each other. That's what was important. We weren't damaged in the fires. We weren't there. So we had an opportunity to start again. And we did. That's beautiful. Who were you when those roles, like when you lost everything, did you think you were someone different or did you just say, OK, I got to settle in this and figure things out? I suppose we were people that always look to the future. We weren't melancholics that like to have naval pity parties. There are people that study their navels and get swept up by the emotion of sadness and what if. They're melancholic type personalities, if you will. Whereas we were more personalities that said, OK, so what's next? How can we go to the next step? What is the next step? And for us at the time, we liked the water. And my husband said, let's get a boat. And as it happened, we got a houseboat. And we were on that houseboat for several years, from 21 to when my husband died. Yes, and the houseboat was more of a floating accommodation, if you will, a floating apartment. And I stayed there while I was waiting for my apartment to be finished. And it's an interesting lifestyle. It was a great lifestyle. It was my husband's happy place. So the oncologist said to him, go to your happy place. And for him, that was a lovely place for him. So as much as we don't often like change, change can be good. And I have coined a blueprint for trauma. I mean, it was traumatic to lose absolutely everything we'd worked so hard. But my little phraseology is called MAP, M-A-P-P, M standing for maintain. Like before a traumatic event, maintain the things that brought you fun and enjoyment. So no matter what the traumatic event be, whether it's a fire or a car accident or whatever, if you were swimming every week or if you were playing bridge every week and you enjoyed that, maintain it. Don't just wipe everything out of your life. Don't give up on everything. Maintain it. No matter how little those little things might be, you might have coffee with your girlfriends once a week. Well, maintain that, keep it going because they are the emotional connections that we still need in our life. The other one is acceptance. I think some people take a long, long time to accept a traumatic event and it happens. You can't deny it. It happens and one has to accept it. In the case of a bushfire, what we know is that six to eight weeks after a bushfire, fresh green shoots of growth come through. Yes, they do. Yeah, it's just perpetual. It's never-ending and the seeds in the trees, they self-propagate and we forget that and that can happen in our lives too. We can have fresh, new, green opportunities. That's beautiful. Fresh, new, green things to explore. So, very important. The other two letters are P and P. The first P being for priority. Prioritise. It forced us, although we knew theoretically that priority is in our life, in practice, we grounded ourselves and knew that our priorities were our faith, our family and our friends. And that was important, the three Fs. They were our priorities. And sometimes we have those priorities, not necessarily in that order, but we don't actually spell it out. And so, we knew that our priorities were our faith, our family and our friends. Then the other P is plan. I think the best way to have hope for any future, no matter what you've been through, is to plan. Plan that holiday. Plan that coffee with your girlfriend. That's great. Plan that little trip. Plan something that's in next week or in a fortnight or in a month, because then you always have something to reel in to come. And it's like putting a hook into your future and then reeling it in. And when you plan something, you're putting hope into your future. And we can plan today what we're doing next week. It's very important to plan. If we stop planning, what have we got to look forward to? Even if it's visiting your grandchild. Even if it's as simple as having a walk to the park. It doesn't have to cost a lot of money. Even if it's having to swim in the sea, you plan it. You make it happen. And those plans give you something to look forward to. And I always found that the more I planned, the more I had to look forward to. And we did that together. And I think that now that it's been four years since my husband passed, but I apply that to my own life now. My priorities, my planning. And I think that's where we all need to be. But nobody really teaches us this stuff. If we go through a tragedy, no matter what, it could be an earthquake, right? There's so many places in the world where there are bushfires. There are volcanic spewing. There are earthquakes. There's tsunamis. There's flooding. All sorts of things that are happening on this earth. But nobody really teaches us how do we overcome a traumatic event? How do we plan for overcoming? You know, is there light at the end of the tunnel? Is it just that happened, therefore life stops? That happened, therefore I am stuck? No. No, we have a mind that has the capacity to plan again and again and again. Yes, absolutely. That's being real. Right. That's really good. That's good. That M-A-P-P, people. M-A-P-P. I love it. Now, you said you stopped trying to live a life that made sense to others. Why do you think there's a need of approval for what is the biggest trap people live in? Why do you think it's one of the biggest traps? Nobody gets to walk in our shoes. And nobody is responsible for my life except me. That's good. Even if there are people who are well-meaning, who think I'm going astray, or think I'm on the wrong path, at the end of the day, it's my choices. Life is about choices. As I said before, life is one big character development program. And at each junction, we have a choice. We have a choice to go to the left. We have a choice to go to the right. We have a choice to create another path. We have choice. And as I said before, I've never been accountable to anyone else but myself. I might have sought advice from someone. And of course, we should. We should seek advice of the wise. But I've always been someone who's followed my heart. And I'm a Christian. And my heart wants to resonate with my creator. And I want my heart to be in alignment with him. And when you have that mindset and that heart set, so to speak, you have a different guidance system. You know, we're all looking for true north. We're all looking for a purpose to be on the planet. And it's very important to find that purpose. Why do we have breath in our bodies? Who put it there? Are we here to make a difference? Well, I believe we are. I believe that a dentist is put in place to fix your teeth. A mechanic is put in place to fix your car. You know, doctors are there to fix things, you know. Through our experiences, we can help others by giving them advice what we've learned. And in a way, by having this chat with you, Edna, I'm passing on some of the things that I've learned. That's right. So much legacy is going on right now. Yeah, yeah. And it's in the book. It's in the book. And the book has a strong emphasis on forgiveness. And each chapter commences with a quotation about forgiveness. And it could be Mahatma Gandhi or Nelson Mandela or Mother Teresa or even Jesus himself who said, we must forgive 70 times seven. Well, that's very, very, very difficult to comprehend. But when you're placed in a position where you need to make a choice, we have a choice to forgive or not to forgive. The choice is always ours. And it's very important. That's probably one of the most important decisions of our lives is not to hold on to a grudge, not to hold on to unforgiveness, not to hold on to resentment because it contaminates us. And medically, it's been proven that unforgiveness, they backfire. And it's like us taking poison and hoping it fixes the other person or gets rid of them or whatever. When really we're in our own cell, if you like, and the capacity and the door lock is on the inside. All we have to do is turn it and walk out, you see. So we don't have to condone someone else's actions. We don't have to trust them ever again. But we need to forgive that there is no anger. Anger is a very eroding emotion. And we have to learn and understand that the choice is definitely ours. Yeah, it is. And we also have to remember to add on to what you're saying, forgiving others, forgive ourselves 70 times seven. And that's important too, because we do a lot for other people. But then when it comes down to us, we forget that we have to have compassion for ourselves. And that's a big emphasis that I see with all my clients is that they don't forgive themselves. They forgive everybody else. They don't forgive themselves for not knowing, for not having the tools. Just simple like, yeah, I made a mistake. Okay, that's a mistake. Forgive yourself. Go on. Don't beat yourself up about it. Because life is about learning. It's about learning. Don't get instructions. I think married into that forgiving ourselves is not to do it again. So if we really have turned around from that behaviour, which is negative, so maybe we have a tendency to gamble. Yes, we can forgive ourselves. But part of the repenting, if you like, is to turn around and not do it again. And so it's easier to forgive yourself when you've stopped the issue, you've stopped the behaviour. That's when you stop the pattern, though. That's pattern. Forgiving, I think, is separate from the pattern itself. Because once you do it a couple of times, it's a pattern now. So now you're not going to ask yourself to forgive yourself for doing something that's a pattern that you're going to keep doing. I'm talking simply like, I made a mistake. Not those type of mistakes. I'm talking like, yeah, I didn't know any better about such and such. And that's when you're talking to yourself. When you're talking to yourself, I didn't know anything about that. Or if I hurt somebody's feeling, and I may think that I'm talking about something, maybe I'm saying something to them that hurt their feelings. Well, I didn't know. I shouldn't have said that. Now, why did I get like that? And then you kind of say, OK, I've got to forgive myself for that. I know better now. That hurts that person. But yeah, I get what you're saying about the gambling and things like that. Yeah, I get that. So let's move on to what you told us about people talk about finding purpose. So it's like it's a big dramatic movement. You describe it differently, that purpose emerged merged quietly. What does that actually look like in real life? I think purpose evolves interlinked with our gifts. OK. It's interlinked. It isn't as simple as one liar. I think it evolves as we grow. And we discover, wow, I can help these people because of all that I've learned from a string of experiences, not necessarily a degree. You know, just because you're a psychologist doesn't mean to say you can actually help someone, especially if you don't have empathy and you don't have compassion. You really haven't got to you haven't left base, you know. So purpose is a knowing in your knower that what I'm doing is making a difference. And and there are very few people that can do what I do. You know, not everyone can do what you do. Not everyone. That's true. We are all unique individuals. And sometimes we have to realign our life so that, you know, we sense we sense purpose. So I think that purpose will be clearly announced at our funeral. They talk about someone's character at the end of life service, the celebration of life service. They talk about character, not necessarily, you know, all the achievements, but more so how they impacted me, how they made me feel, how I loved. They are the things that last, you know, how you you made me feel like I was the only person on the planet and you were listening to me. That's very important, far more important than any degree or skill or award. I think all of that is linked to purpose. You know, what impact did we have on somebody's life? That's beautiful. That's really, really beautiful. I like that. I like how you kind of changed that. All right. And about the reflection on the on the funeral. I was like, oh, they do do that. No resume needed. No resume. It didn't dawn on me until you said it. I was like, that's right. No resume needed. They talk about all the character and what you bestowed upon other people. So it's so powerful. That is. And it's really powerful. So let's go to my thing. I wish I wish they said all the nice things to my face before I die. Yes, no. Come on. Yeah. Yes. You you shared with with us before you spoke, but you said something powerful. And I wanted to bring it out. You said real relationships are built on truth, not comfort. Can you expound on that? Could you repeat that again, please? You said something powerful. Real relationships are built on truth, not comfort. Can you explain that? Can you share that? Relationships? Yeah. Well, relationships are really everything in this world. And and for eternity. Truth is something that will last for eternity. So there are a lot of things that make people feel comfortable, but many times they're just passing by. They're fleeting. So truth, truth will always outshine anything that's wrong or eventually truth will win. Temporarily, sometimes truth looks like it's hidden and the bad guy wins. But you have to realize that truth will always be revealed eventually. Yes. Yeah. If not immediately, if not immediately. That's right. It'll come out. So could you tell us, like, where can we find you? Where can the audience find you and a little bit about the book? Yes. Okay. So my website is Helen Glanville dot com. That's my name dot com. And in there, there is a landing page forward slash by book forward slash. The book is called A Second Chance. And essentially, it's a description of how we met Jeff's life before he met me, my life before I met him. So it's true romance and true crime. It's redemption because he died at 86. But the first half of his life, he was a prodigal. He wasted his life. Whereas the second half of his life, he turned it around from being selfish to service. From being, in a way, a disgrace to serving others. And I think that we need to understand that serving others is really what it's all about. And he could have, as a lawyer, he could have easily gone back into the world and made money. But he chose not to. He chose to help people who he knew needed his help. Because of his experience, you see, he was in a Brazilian prison for 15 months, where they were trying to get an extradition treaty between Australia and Brazil back in the mid-70s. It was an excruciating ordeal for him. He was a millionaire in Sydney. He lost everything. He was a high-flying lawyer, well-trusted. But there was a financial credit squeeze. And unfortunately, he was tempted to touch his trust account. And that's a no-no for lawyers. But he fled. Instead of staying and facing the music, he fled and he went to Rio. He was there for a few months without being found. But then his mistress at the time flew to Rio. He met her at the airport. And that's how Interpol caught up with him. So he paid heavily for what he did. There were quite a few lawyers in that decade that were struck off the role. He was made bankrupt. He was a very, very wealthy man in his own right. He had inherited quite a huge amount of money from his father. But he overextended himself. He overinvested. And he couldn't keep up with the commitments. So all of the headlines of the mid-70s are in the book. So lawyer, please, Sidney, lawyer returns, all of that. So he was a family lawyer. And that's the interesting story. He was our family lawyer. And my father had a dream to help him. We thought my dad was an idiot. But he said no. He said if I had lost everything, lost my station in life, lost my wealth, was struck off the list of lawyers, my wife divorced me while I was overseas, I'd like to think somebody somewhere would give me a second chance. So that's the name of the book. Okay, awesome. So, audience, what I take from this conversation is that people are not defined by their worst moments, their losses, or their judgments placed on them. They're defined by the choices that they make after everything falls apart. And sometimes the most powerful and transformative decisions don't just come from winning, comes from rebuilding. If today's conversation resonated with you, share it with someone who might be quietly rebuilding their life right now. And if you're navigating a season where you're trying to figure out what comes next, remember, purpose doesn't always arrive with fireworks. Sometimes it shows up quietly when you decide to live honestly. This is Keeping It Real On Purpose, where real stories remind you that starting over is not a failure, it's clarity. And my name is Edna White, and my esteemed guest, Helen Granville, saying goodbye for now.