God, WHY CAN’T I HAVE A BABY?/ - Celes Reflection

Welcome to my YouTube channel. Welcome to Seller's Reflection. Here we talk about a lot. We learn and unlearn things. That's why I have a guest today and her name is like my mom's mom. My mom's, my ma, my. Both my mom's name. Both my mom in law and my mama called Jane. Maybe we are related. I'm irritated. And my dad in love and my dad are called Bernard. Wow. Okay, now that one we don't have. Ha, ha, ha, ha. Welcome so much, Jane. Thank you. You can introduce yourself. Okay. My name is Jane Geshohi, a mother of four, and married to an amazing, incredible, handsome guy. Oh, wow. For the last 30 plus years, his name is Nelson Geshohi. He's Pastor Nelson Geshohi. Oh, wow. Yeah. Welcome so much. When I saw this, I was like, God, why can't I have a baby? There will be so many, so many women like us. So, so many women are asking themselves, asking God this question. Yes. Almost every minute, God, why can't I have, be it the firstborn, be it the secondborn, be it, like, people asking that question. So, when I heard about your story, maybe you can touch about your story. For how many years, like, before you got your first baby, how many years was it so that someone can understand? But of course, if they want to understand in depth, this is the book to read. Yes. About eight years, around seven to eight years of waiting and trusting and expecting. You know, it's like you begin, you finish school. You graduate from campus and you get married and you have this grand plan that maybe after two years you will have children. You almost have the names picked out. I wanted four. And I wanted two boys and two girls. So the first year it's like, okay. The second year is not too bad. Year number three, it's like, hey. What's going on? Number four, we have issues. So of course, by that time, you're seeing the doctor and you're hopeful. The doctor is hopeful and they say, we'll put you on this treatment. This is your problem. You have polycystic ovarian disease. You have a blocked tube. We'll put you on treatment and you will be okay. And you believe the doctor. Then you try two months, three months, four months down the line, nothing. Then you go for another try. They say, okay, that one didn't work, but we have this one. This one will work. And you're put on, I remember one of the medication I was put on was called Clomid. And I thought this one will work. So you do it for another few months, two months, three months, four months, nothing. You change the doctor. You try something else. So by that time, it's year four, year five, year six. And quite honestly, by that time, I was starting to get really depressed. Yeah, so I'm trying to digest all this. I'm trying to digest because most of us are like, I want to get married, get kids by 30, live a life from 30, I want to travel. So by this time, you're almost like your dream Whatever you envisioned after getting married, it's not happening. It's not happening. Everything is not happening. Some things are happening. But at that time, you are so focused on children that it's like everything else fades. And it's just this, I can't have children. I can't have children. And that's what kind of led me to a depression. Because you're so consumed with it and it's feeling like, God, why? What have I done? You know, why are you rejecting me? Why are you doing this to me? Because there's this assumption that I had that because I love you and I'm serving you, then I'm going to be blessed. Were you a pastor by then? Yes, I was. So all this time you're going to church, you don't have a baby, you can see kids. Yes, that was hard. Especially the baby dedications, the baby showers. And sometimes I'd even wonder, do these people want me to lay hands on them? Because will they feel like I'm passing on barrenness? It's such a ridiculous idea. But at that time when you're in so much pain, it looks like maybe you feel like you're rejected by people because there's a part of you that's rejecting your condition and where you're at. Because a woman, you get married, you get children. I have my four and now they're not there. So what am I supposed to do? You know, it's like everything else. Because of this one thing becomes unimportant. Because when we got married, I was 25. My husband was 27. We were so in love. I loved what I was doing. I loved serving God. I loved doing stuff. Then after some time, it's like, I don't want to get out of the house. I don't want to go to church. Because I feel a sense of condemnation. It's like, what am I preaching? God, he hears prayers, he answers. And mine are not. And it's obvious. Yeah. Yes. Now, this is me thinking, and I'm sorry. It's okay. The church. Yes. The church has so many judgmental people. Like, I don't know how, but that is how I feel. Yes. That is me thinking, and that is... Well, I don't know if I should say this here. No, it's okay to say it. But personally, I feel like those people who judge the most hypocritical, I don't want to say they are hypocritical, but we have a majority of them in the church. Thank you very much. You know what I found out? At the point when I was hurting so badly and I was in so much pain, I was hearing the voices of people who are being judgmental. But the reality is that there were so many more in retrospect that were standing with us. Now I got to learn there were people fasting for us, people who were praying for us, people who were there for us. You got to learn about that after you got the babies or during that period? They were actually there. But because this stigma is so huge, the voices of the naysayers were actually louder. Than the voices of those guys who are embracing me. Because they were there. I mean, there are people who would come, you know, be sweet. They were nice. But it felt like there were few. Because my pain, you know how when you have a wound, if somebody hits that wound, it's very, very, very painful. It could just be a cut. But you feel it so much more deeply and your whole body reacts. So that's where it was. I have this wound. So everything that hurts this wound, if somebody hugs me, I don't feel, I appreciate the hug, but this one. So the negative things were what I was hearing. And later in retrospect, I was like, Jane. There was so much support. There were so many people who were feeling you. I wish I had listened to them more. And now that has become a personal life philosophy. There will always be naysayers in life. But there are also people who are for you. And I choose to celebrate those who are for me rather than focusing on the negative because negative will always be there. It will always be there. But there are so many other people. Do you know at the hospital, There were ladies who came when I was giving birth the first time who were there praying the whole night because I had a very difficult... That is after eight years. Yes, it was difficult. Actually, we almost lost our daughter. In fact, she was in the incubator for two days. But there were people there praying, supporting us, making sure my husband was taken care of and fed. You know, and that was that baby. The next baby also had complications. You know, you think at dinner you're getting your miracles, things are going to be smooth. They were not. You know, we still had challenges. By the last baby, he was premature. He had so many problems, but there were people surrounding us. In fact, by the time we were getting that child, we had to move house. I was supposed to be on bed rest because I have a condition where my uterus was always threatening to rupture. And there were people who came, packed my things, moved my things to the new house, cleaned it up, took care of the other children, the other three. So there were, we were always surrounded, but there were the naysayers and those ones. They are always there. They're always there. In fact, I have a saying, I say church is like a hospital. you have people who are responding to treatment and you have people who are not responding and they do not even want it but they are there and they are those who are sick and they know how to be treated they do not want they are not sick according to them so during those eight years like during that period where you are constantly asking god god why god why there are things that People will say that will hurt you not knowing that they are hurting you because you see See? in our society we expect I respect Ukiyo-lewa Miakambili. yes which right now we are learning sweuliza mtu ukuanini ampating tuto Right now we know better yeah but there are some of the things that maybe you know to see why you lose a mother tender don't say this don't say this thing to this person yes because even then they feel bad already about what is going on Yeah, definitely. Some of the things that were said, I remember one lady coming to me and saying, you know, people are saying Pastor Nelson was such a fool to have married a barren woman. Um... Well, I learned she was not being nice. She was among those ones who were being mean. But I really took it to heart. And I felt horrible because my husband loves kids. Wherever he goes, kids follow him to this day. Thank you. And I felt like there's something wrong with me. You know, I wish he had married somebody else who would give him children. Then there are those ones who are like, hey, you guys, this kind of love. You don't want kids? Why are you taking so long? Leave people, unless they tell you why they are taking so long, don't go and start asking them, you know, why. It's good to talk, it's good to engage, you know, but it takes a lot of wisdom and some degree of intimacy in a relationship, being a very good friend with somebody to go and asking them such personal questions, because it's very personal. Then there are those ones who, after realizing, of course, they can tell, five years, this is not family planning. They're just, there's a situation here. And the relative said, see, you go and ask your sister-in-law or your brother-in-law, your relas, to have a baby. For you. For you. And then they give you the baby to raise as your own. And then there were some who told my husband, see, you just get another wife. And get a baby. This one. This one is not bringing children, which I personally feel is so unfair because sometimes it's the man who has a problem. It's not always the woman. It's not always the woman. In my case, it was me. But many times, it's not always the woman. And that's really... It's difficult, it's challenging. I have a friend who had like six, seven miscarriages and eventually her husband walked out on her when she was still in hospital with the final miscarriage and went and married somebody else. It's hard. It is tough. It is tough. Somebody's going through a hard time. But I think the stigma is not just even what people are saying about you in society. It's the lies, because they really are lies that you say to yourself, there's something wrong with me. I'm not a whole woman. I'm an incomplete woman. It's not true. So sometimes it's even you being hard on yourself. Yes, yes. Like I'll tell you what, Cele. There's a time I went to a bookshop and I was looking for books on barrenness. And I was, you know, it's like there's a shame. You don't want people to see you looking for that book. But I wanted, it's like I want somebody to talk to me. I'm feeling isolated. I'm feeling alone. But I also don't want people to know that I am barren, you know. And I tell myself, Jane, you know better. It's not your fault. You have a medical condition. You have not done this to yourself. But still there's that feeling. Maybe if I'm a better person. Maybe if I'm a better Christian. And it's not true. You just have a medical condition that you need to go and get checked. Also, the society has made it seem like you need to have kids by 35. You had your first kid at? 30. 40. 34, 35. 41. 42. So the society has made it like, 43. when you get there, you can't have kids. 44. 45. Maybe 33. 46. 47. Yes. 48. My last born I got when I was 39. 49. 50. 51. See? Yes. 52. So, these things, the perception that society has given us... 53. 54. 55. It's true. 56. Yeah, get married, have kids in the first two years. 57. 58. Like, it's not cast on stone. 59. 60. 61. 62. Like, in the first five years, she'll have two kids. 63. 64. No. In fact, what I regret is that I was so focused. 65. 66. 67. 68. Especially there, Kitu, maybe... Three, four years on having a child and not having a child. That in retrospect, my child, one of my kids was asking me, Mom, what do you regret in life? And I said, you know what? I regret that I didn't go for more holidays. That I didn't do more things with your dad. Because you guys weren't there. When you guys came, the house was a mess. You know? There was a time I'd look at my house and wish there were toys to trip on. But instead of living in that regret, I should have enjoyed life more. It's like I put a pause on my life. I know. Until these children come, I will not enjoy life. I love that. I will cry here. I will get angry here. And I was angry. Just waiting for children. And I was angry. So for the eight years, most of the time you were crying, angry, instead of making good use of that time. The middle. The first part, I was busy. I was having fun. Okay. I had met my husband when I was 19. He was 21. He's an awesome guy. We had fun. After some time, I'm doing things in church, but now it's becoming automatic. There was a time I'd wake up and I don't want to go to church. But it's like, now how does the pastor's wife not go to church? How do I not turn up? You know, so those were like the middle years. Then came the time when I decided enough is enough. I can't live here. I can't live sad all the time. I do want to enjoy life. I do want to get out of this. I want to get out of this depression, because it was a depression. And I got help, you know, slowly. I normally say our Kenyan way, slowly by slowly. I got out of it, and I got to the place where I was more accepting. And I came, now when I was saying, God, why can't I have a baby? It was more like, okay, God, just tell me, just tell me. So that this story, we just close this chapter, and I move on with my life. You'll be at peace. And just be at peace, and just move on. If I'm never gone, because people would come and say, your house is so neat. And for me, I'd feel horrible, because it's like, I don't want a neat house. I want a messy house. I want a baby crying and screaming and painting on the walls. When you hear mothers saying they didn't sleep at night, you're like, I want to be... I want it. I want it. And sometimes, in fact, to go back a bit, when I'd be with people, they'd get so engrossed talking about their babies that I'd feel so isolated. It's like, man, be a little sensitive. And they'd be talking about diaper rash and whatever. And I'm just there, not because I don't... It's like I can't relate. Yeah, you don't have anything to say. I can't relate. I don't have anything to say. So I'd end up just walking away. Like, did you wish that Siwangi on Giavit was in Guinea another time? Yeah, I did. I did. I did. And what I do is many times walk away or if I know there's a children, something happening, find creative ways to get out of it. But if I can't get out of going to the party like if it's family, then I'd find things to do even with the children. Because children are so loving and so accepting. Just to distract myself. Because I know if I go where the mothers are seated, some are comparing baby bumps or milestones. There's nothing wrong with that. There's nothing wrong. It's just that when it's two hours of baby bumps and diaper rash. It's like, I can't contribute. And you know, that was one of the reasons that I felt like there's need for me to have you here. Because most of the time I'm talking with mums. And I know I have an audience out there who can't. Yes. Who wants to hear this. Yes. Because you see... It's not like we do it maliciously. Yes. You just find yourself talking about, oh, you see, my baby, you know, you're the first one. Most of the time, you're not sensitive. It's actually okay to talk about your children because, again, you don't want people to... Clamp up. It's okay. It's just that be sensitive that that's not all you talk about. Talk about kids. Even give me your baby to hold. Even give me your baby to change. Involve me, but don't let it just be exclusive about children. Yeah, so talk about kids. It's important, but not exclusively. That's where you feel after some, by the second hour, third hour, fourth hour, you're wilting, you're disconnecting, And you start feeling alone. So it's good also to maybe you check your environment. Like if I'm talking about... It's like in school, when we were talking about our parents, maybe there was someone without a parent and you're like, oh my God. You know? Yeah, I think. Yeah, in fact, somebody helped me once. They said, you know, the women who are asking God, why can't I have a baby? Mm-hmm. They are also single women who want to be married. And they are getting older. They are also crying. They would also like to have a family. So that has also made me sensitive to other. Sensitive. other people you know and their needs and to know that even with my friends who are old and don't are not married planning um and having things that we do together that is that are fun that have nothing to do with children because they still they're still great people they're still people and wonderful friends but we come together for our kids but we also work together for you and have fun with you as a person my girlfriends you know still do things together because they also would like to have a baby but they don't. The time is not yet. The time is not yet like we said I got my baby later well my age is now 57 and it's a bit late but you can also adopt yeah yeah so my question is now that later on after after all that after the Depression, everything happened. You later got babies. Now you have, now it's like you've experienced both. As much as you were trying to say barrenness, but you are not. It was just the time wasn't right. The time wasn't yet there. So now that you've seen all these sides, what do you feel like, what can you say about what was God doing? Because I feel like there's something being looked at right now. The fact that you're saying, I wish I'd used that time to do something. It's because now you have kids. Maybe they would have been friends, even I would still be asking, God, why? Yes. I know what I know God was working in me is one, a sense of entitlement as a Christian. Because I have lived like this, I'm expecting God will do this. So when God doesn't do this, I'm angry. And it doesn't feel like, it just feels like, God, you're unfair. And I'm doing this, you're not doing this. Yes, I'm doing this for you. And I realized, no, God is sovereign. God is good. Even through the hard times. And good people will suffer. You know, You know, suffering, difficulty, challenges are there. However, with God, it's possible to overcome and to see good even in difficult things. I... I... You've answered a question that I keep on asking God. Why do good people suffer? They suffer because we live in a fallen world. We live in a world where nothing is perfect. It's always the good people who go through tough things, bad things. I think it's both people, but it really stands out when it's the good people. You know, when you're feeling this one should not suffer like this. I know. This one, you're like, God, this one. I'm sure in your church there was someone who was like, God, not Jane. I'm sure there was someone who was like, not that girl, Jane. Yes. And people have even asked me, would ask me why. You, you know, even me, I'd say, God, why me? Then I realized there's a sense of pride there. It's like, so I shouldn't suffer because I'm a pastor's wife. But what I did learn through that is that God is faithful. Even in the situations that you don't understand, even in situations that don't make sense, he's faithful. And somewhere down the line, there's understanding that comes not always. There's understanding, but when I am convinced that God is good, it helps you. You know, it helps you run to him. I still have very open conversations with God. You know, I want to understand God help me. It's made me a stronger person. It's made me a stronger person. It's actually made my faith stronger. Because I know he's come through for me so many times. I mean, we've gone through such difficulties. Then he's come through. So I know those difficulties, whether I believed in him or not, would have been there. The difference is that he's walking with me through that and helping me overcome. So they become easier. I love it. I love it. So where can people read this story? Because guys are wondering, what was that journey like? Like, what point did it get to? You start getting children, you get one, two, three, four. People really want to know. So where can they get this book? You can get this book at Keswick. You can get it at Catholic Bookshop. You can get it online. And you can get it through the Taji. website so we can share those contacts with you yeah yeah we will share because it's a it's a nice read i'm going to read at least me i know the story a bit of the story it was it's it's a very inspiring story especially to those young ladies why can't i get a husband why can't i get a baby why can't i get a job like you forget about all the good things that are happening yes You focus on this thing. Why can't I? And there's a lot of good happening. Like I said, sometimes you can look at a glass as half empty or half full. It's a matter of perspective. To this day, it doesn't mean that challenges you had you know, that now because you got kids. In fact, getting those babies had their own challenges. The last one was premature. You know, we had to pray through, believe God for His help. You know, where the doctor had said we can't guarantee he'll even live. He's now 18. He turned 18 yesterday. He turned 18 and he's... Yesterday? Yes. We share a birthday. You do September 3rd? Yeah, September 3rd. He turned 18 and he's very healthy. He's a six foot four guy. He plays for the national team basketball. You know, so does his brother also, who had serious complications, you know, getting both of them. In fact, I remember in the hospital, The doctor, when I went in with the last one, says, hey, come see the miracle lady. Because we've been through so much. The girls, they are doing so well. I have two girls and two boys like I'd always wanted. And I'm so proud of all of them. They are not perfect kids. They are wonderful children. Yes. I love that. I love that. I feel people becoming encouraged. Good news. God has, I feel like God is very... Has a lot of, some sense of humor. Because those nine years that he was just sitting there, he knows you, that day you will start to get them. Yes. It's like he's even looking at me and thinking, I have all these goodies on the side. Why are you focused here? Why are you focused here? It's like, Tan, see what I have for you. You want a baby. You want a baby. If you don't give me a baby, I won't be happy. Until you do. I'm like, watch. and that is most of us, most of us right now before we focus on the bad yeah and forget about all these good things all these amazing things that are happening so you're not grateful you're moved complaining all the time and you know what also happens it's like when you feel god is letting you down you decide to walk away from him and what i say is that When you're feeling down, that's when you need to get closer to Him. Because you will walk, like I said, my issues won't get finished. And you'll start getting into places that are taking you into deeper problems. And God is trying to say, Jane, come, come. There is a trap there. But you can't hear, so you walk away. Then you go to the other side, you say, now see God. Now see God. It's like God is like, I can't win. I am trying to tell you, but you have closed your ears, you walk away. Then you decide, in fact, I won't even believe in you. I won't even believe in you. And you keep going, kwa masipa, kwa what? And it's like, God is like, I was trying to. There's a verse that says, he orders our steps. He guides us, he leads us. But how will he lead you when you have led yourself? So in those six, seven years, I led myself to a lot of places. And it's like, God is like, what am I supposed to do? I can't force you. God doesn't force himself on us. He just says come because he says our steps are ordered of the Lord. He wants to guide us. He wants to lead us because he sees. He sees this is a fallen world. He sees what's ahead of us and he wants to lead us. The Bible says into triumph, but it means that before the triumph, there will be battles. And I believe he gives you a battle that you're able to win. Yes. He gives each and every one of us a battle that you're capable of handling. He can't give you something that you can't handle. And that is in the Bible. He says that. Thank you so much, Jane. I feel so good having you here. Thank you. Especially because of those followers of mine who are constantly asking this question. God, why this? God, why me? God, why? yes yeah so thank you so much and guys please get this book Facebook, he, him, no, no, I'm sorry. you're going to get us an audio Thank you. soon we hope to have an audio book soon What are we going to do? Do you want to talk about IAFONS? but it looks like a very easy read this one it's going to be my first book Awesome! Hallelujah! and this is the story guys like it's very inspiring it's very encouraging Share it with your friends, share it with your... Like, let's at least create sensitive curiosity in a way. I feel like that's where our society is struggling. We want to. And you know nowadays, people say we marry and we don't want kids. Yeah. Like we don't want kids. Yes. And it's okay. I feel it's okay. My mom does not feel it's okay. I feel it's okay. I have to agree with your mom. That's why we are in sex. Thanks. My mom is, my mom in love. No, you need to. She's also a pastor by the way. Yes. I'm like, it's okay. Me, I agree with her. It's okay. Like, it's okay. If you can have children, have them. If I don't want, it's okay. I imagine if everybody decides they don't want, where will Kenya be? A desert, an inhabited place. I'm sure it's stuck at the same thing. But thank you so much, Jen, for coming. Thank you guys for watching. I hope to see you again next time. Thank you. With another book. Thank you. I have another one, but another one, a third one. Yeah. Thank you so much, guys. Bye-bye. Bye. Thank you. Bye.