Watch how Nick Powers is transforming lives through Free Scuba education .

Well, good afternoon. This is Benjamin Hatfield with Teach Me To Dive, technical dive instructor in Idaho, reaching out and bringing you the most interesting comments and information you can possibly do about diving and different things going on today. We're really excited. We've got Nick from Warfighter Scuba in Honduras with us today. Nick runs a fantastic program that's dedicated to our nation's veterans that are Purple Heart recipients or farther, that he does an adaptive program and if you're not familiar with adaptive program, we'll probably let Nick talk more about that, but that's where they've lost an arm or a leg or are paraplegic or quadriplegic in some cases, um, certainly more rare cases, but they've been wounded in action somehow. And they've come back to us in damage. And so Nick's processing this, he helps put it back together through scuba. Now, this is something that's near and dear to my heart. We're, uh, Nick and I are both veterans and, and, uh, we love our nation as well. Nick, thank you for coming on today. I appreciate you. Thanks for having me, Benjamin. I appreciate it too. Well, Nick, can you tell us a little bit about yourself and your background and diving in the military? Uh, yeah. So I, I joined the Marine Corps in 2003, um, deployed to Iraq in 2006. Got out of the Marine Corps in 2007, back to Iraq in 2008 as a private security contractor and did that on and off for the next four or five years. Um, all said and done, I got about three years spent in Iraq all over that place. Um, didn't do any diving while I was in. Um, I got certified to dive back in 1998 when I was 12 years old. Um, went on a, uh, I think it was a sixth grade field trip to Catalina Island and we did some snorkeling and, and I saw scuba divers and my dad was one of the, uh, what do you call it? Chaperones on the trip. And I said, dad, I want to learn that. And you know, my dad made it happen. So I got certified at 12, but I didn't do any kind of diving in the military. Um, I, I still kick myself in the butt though, because I had all my scuba equipment in my wall locker in the barracks and instead of diving in Hawaii where I was stationed, I was too busy getting drunk when we weren't in the field, so, uh, had the opportunity. I just never did it. Um, and I didn't really get back into it until I moved to Rotan, uh, in 2016. And, uh, that's when I really started like getting back into diving. This was really not much to do on this Island other than drink your face off or scuba dive. So, um, I did very well at drinking my face off and, uh, found out that I'm a raging alcoholic. And in that, uh, you know, my PTSD and everything was pretty significant. Um, but with getting back into scuba diving, it, it started allowing me to clear my head. And, um, that's kind of what led to, to founding, you know, warfighter scuba is, um, for years, I haven't been able to clear my head and getting back into scuba diving was able to bring me to the present moment where I wasn't. Thinking about all the stupid crap that was normally occupying my head. And that was the first time I ever talked to some of my buddies and said, Hey, I have an idea and they didn't laugh me out of the room. So, uh, warfighter scuba was born, you know, and, uh, you know, I've been. Six years sober now, um, feel great. You know, I don't have, don't have any of my night tremors or any, any kind of PTSD lingering, you know, that I really consider PTSD, obviously, uh, stress and anxiety and things like that are still daily, but, um, you know, when, when we're diving, it's gone. It doesn't, it doesn't exist. And, uh, that's been one of the things that, that I could probably say a hundred percent of our veterans who've come through the program. We'll attest to, um, you know, we, we do, uh, like you said, purple heart recipients, um, and you know, we had, we've had amputees come and not to sound, uh, what's the word not to sound bad, but, you know, I think the amputees get the most out of our program because they're, you know, they get to experience weightlessness, you know, you get, you get double leg amputees above the knee, um, and they're able to move in any direction they want without a wheelchair, without prosthetics, without, um, without anything. And, you know, when you see that joy in their face that they can move without being restricted to some kind of device, um, there's not much that can top that in, in, in feel good moments. Um, we haven't, we haven't had any, uh, um, quadriplegics or, or serious, uh, paralyzations yet. Um, I had a, uh, uh, uh, below the waist, um, paralyzed. He absolutely loved it. You know, being able to move around with his arms and breathing. Um, I don't know. It's, it's, man, it's just so enjoyable. I, I, I love scuba diving, but when you get to take people out on the adaptive side, it's like, it's so much better. I mean, it, it, it just, I don't know. You see, you see a joy that, that you can't really describe. And that's, I don't know. It's just so nice. That is amazing. And thank you for your service and congratulations on six years of sobriety is a huge goal and a thing to accomplish. So congratulations on your hard work on that. That is for sure. So, uh, Nick, can you can explain a little bit about the mission and the goals of warfighter scuba, especially in relationship with working with these veterans and for ours? Yeah. I mean, so the mission obviously is, is we're trying to, to teach a positive skillset, um, to help occupy the wounded veterans time, you know, um, the beauty of scuba diving is 70, depending on which agency you look at 71 to 78% of the planet's covered in water, right? So this, this is a, uh, a skill and a tool that you can use literally worldwide. Um, and it's one that, you know, it's, it's physical, so it does allow you to get physical activity. And like I said, for the, the, the seriously wounded veterans, it allows them a sense of freedom that they can't get anywhere else unless, unless they went up to space. I mean, I guess that might be a, an option at some point in our future. We might see that, but, um, you know, for now we're kind of limited to what we can do here on earth. Um, and, uh, it's just our missions to spread that, you know, my, my personal goal, I've had way too many of my friends commit suicide. Um, you know, I tried to take my own life years ago, uh, and unsuccessfully, thank God, but, um, you know, to decrease the, the suicide epidemic in, in our veteran community is, is definitely one of our, our mission points, and then, uh, I'm a, I'm a huge proponent of marriage and relationships. So, uh, we always invite, uh, our married veterans to bring their spouses. And that's been proving to be a very, um, amazing part of our mission is when we have a husband and a wife come through the program together, um, they learn scuba diving together, they lose, lose it, uh, they learn a skill set they can use anywhere together. And I can't tell you how many spouses have pulled me aside and thank me because, you know, most, most veteran organizations, it's usually just for the veteran and, um, spouses don't get to really experience what the veteran goes through and with our program, they do they're right next to the veteran throughout the entire process. And, um, they get to hear the stories. They get to hear conversations that they've never heard their, their husband or wife, you know, say in front of them. And it's, it's led to a lot of marriages, you know, really gaining a lot more closeness and, um, uh, what's the word? Um, you know, bringing them back together, there's no more barrier wall between, I don't really want to tell my wife what I went through. She won't understand. But when you get that veteran in a circle with other veterans who have the same, you know, uh, life experiences in combat that just happens, those conversations happen and they feel more comfortable. And then their wives get to participate and actually understand a hell of a lot more of what their spouse went through. That's amazing. Yeah. Helping marriages, helping the vets. I guess what a, what an amazing side benefit. I would not have expected to hear that as in today's conversation. I, yeah, it's, it's, it's surprising. You know, I, every marriage has issues, right? You know, my, my wife and I, uh, I mean, we've been married twice. We divorced and remarried. So, um, you know, I, I know what, uh, um, marital problems look like. And, you know, a lot of it had to do with my drinking and my PTSD and my anger. And, um, you know, I, it's one of my goals to, to try and help couples prevent that. You know, I, I, it's more than just scuba diving. You know, it's, it's truly a, uh, we're trying to make lifestyle changes and in the positive direction for every veteran that comes through. Um, and then that same time build a network that those veterans can then reach out to and, you know, go on dive trips together and, and we've had multiple veterans do that. You know, they meet, they meet different veterans while they're here. I was getting texted from a couple of veterans who met down here in Rotan, who decided to go do their advanced in, um, uh, Massachusetts. And the whole time they were texting me, you know, sending me pictures and their dry suits going, Oh man, Rotan is so much different than this. You know, it's, it's freezing here. We can only see three feet. Um, but you know, everywhere you go, you know, a dive is a dive, whether you have a hundred foot visibility or. You know, not even a foot of visibility. You can still experience, you know, the same like therapy under pressure. It's, I don't know. I don't know how else to describe it. You know, I know divers understand it, but when you try to describe like what we do for the veterans, people who have no knowledge or have never tried scuba diving, they just kind of look at you sideways because it's really, it's really hard to explain what goes on. That's, that's amazing. Um, I mean, literally speechless that I, uh, I love that their divers decided that the next place they wanted to go to was Massachusetts, Idaho, pretty much the same thing. We know what I, we know what road 10 is about and I know what Idaho is about, that's for sure. And it's not about clean hundred foot visibility that we're warm water. I'm teaching tomorrow. As a matter of fact, I've got a tech course. We're going out to 130 feet in the local Lake Ruby, 40 degrees. If we're lucky, it'll be a long time. I don't know how you do it, man. I I'm spoiled. You know, I've been teaching here for six years now. And, um, when I did my trainer course, we were in, uh, uh, Fort Lauderdale. And I don't know if you've ever been there or heard of the whole lot where we did all of our water work. And needless to say, I was kind of the, the, the, the class joke because I'd never taught in anything, you know, it's a hundred, a bad day here is like 60 sure. And that's like an amazing day in Florida or, you know, or anywhere else in the United States. And tiger tail was about three foot is, and, you know, I'm having to sit there and do an entire evaluation, you know, for, you know, the instructor trainer program, I'm just like, I can't see anything. I don't know what I'm looking at. I'm so, I'm so out of my element. Am I even supposed to be here? Like, and, uh, and then, uh, was it last month or two months ago, a friend of mine asked me to fly up and teach one of his buddies in Texas, and I got to go dive in Canyon Lake and do an open water course there for him and his wife. And again, I was just like, wow, I'm so spoiled to rotate. Yes. We hit a thermal client at like, I think we hit a thermal client at like 30 feet ish or a fresh spring feed or something. I was in a three mil suit and I was just like, immediately like, Oh my God, I gotta go, we gotta get away from here. I think it dropped to like 60 degrees, which I'm sure you laugh at, but. You know, it's, I just finished a free diving course today. It is 87 degree water temp. So nice, nice. It's like bath water here. No, I get it completely. So Nick, as an instructor, um, can you walk us through the process of becoming an adaptive instructor? So SSI has a program called classified. Um, they're like one of the only agencies that actually has their own adaptive. I know you have dive part, you have, uh, Oh, there's a handful. There's what HSA. Um, but as far as like, um, the big agencies go, SSI has their own and it's called classified diving. And you can, you as a normal diver can, can go to a classified diving seminar and you can learn to become a classified dive buddy, um, which is a really fun course, you know, you get to actually. Uh, put different masks on to, to feel what it's like to be a blind or partially blind diver. Um, you, you, you know, you take your fins off and you don't use your legs and, you know, you learn how to control people with different, um, different injuries or, or different capabilities. Um, so that way you can be a dive buddy for, uh, a classified diver, an adaptive diver. Um, there's different levels in classified, depending on how severe the, um, uh, the disabilities are, um, you know, since, since our inception, we actually haven't had to use classified for any of our veterans because they've been able to do all the open water standards. Uh, and that's one of the great things about SSI, uh, is, you know, it's all in one for us. And SSI has been one of our biggest supporters since we were just an idea. I didn't even have the, the, you know, the, the company incorporated or anything. Um, when I talked to, to Guido, they were down here doing a photo shoot in 2016 and I told him I had an idea and he said, we'll support you and they've supported us from day one. I mean, they've been absolutely incredible. Um, but the thing with SSI is, you know, if we can push an adaptive diver all the way through open water, they can do all the skills, um, without assistance, then they can get a full open water search. Whereas if, you know, somebody might struggle and they can't complete the mask without assistance, or they can't complete the, you know, emergency swimming center or some kind of skill without assistance, then we can go into the classified program for that. And then depending on how, you know, what skills they can do depends on how many adaptive buddies you need, um, to, to, to dive with you. Gotcha. That's fantastic. So what kind of certifications are required to become an adaptive instructor and how can someone get in, um, that's interested in that become an adaptive instructor? So an open water instructor can, can become a classified diving instructor. Um, and I highly recommend taking the course because even if, if you plan on using it once every so often, I mean, I love teaching open water again, don't get me wrong, but like when you, when you work in that, it changes you in a way that you don't understand, like if you're giving back, you're, you're, you're giving somebody something that they, they can't experience anywhere else. Um, and, and again, to see that as an instructor teaching, you know, somebody with disabilities or, you know, somebody with disabilities and their friends to be able to dive with them, it's just incredible. I mean, it's, it's life-changing it's therapy. Like you, you, you, I don't think, I don't think a lot of scuba divers in general understand what they really get, um, every time they're diving. And if you start expanding that into helping people with the, the adaptive needs, it's just, I don't know. It's like heaven on earth. There really is. It's just so much fun to help. Like, I don't know. I'm grinning like an idiot, just thinking about it. So. Great. And, uh, so as we kind of move through this, what kind of key characters is traits do you believe are essential to work with people that are adaptive, um, or with veterans? And it seems like those might be same, but it's different skill sets as well, to be honest with you. Patience. I mean, patience for sure. Um, you know, and, and surprisingly, especially on the veteran side, um, you know, you get a lot of different mentalities, most veterans are type a, so you get a lot of, you know, thick headedness and, um, no, no, that never happened. Come on. You're joking. Sometimes it's like herding cats underwater, man. I swear, but you know, it's always in a fun and safe manner. Um, but on the, on the adaptive side, um, there's, there's a sense of pride there that, that a lot of times people have a hard time asking for assistance, if that makes sense. Uh, especially with the veterans, you know, the veterans want to do everything themselves. Um, you know, which, which is good. You know, I'm, I'm not a proponent for, for not trying to do everything yourself, but you have to be patient sometimes because everybody learns at different speeds. And when you start getting into that, you could have one person learning really quick and another one struggling a little bit. So you have to, you have to find a way to, to, to kind of meet in the middle. So you're not leaving people out. Fair enough. So what kind of, uh, challenges to do adaptive diver spaces that go through this process and how do you at warfighter scuba address those challenges so they can have a safe and fulfilling experience? So, I mean, we typically have one to two certified assistants with all of our groups, like my wife, she's, uh, she's actually doing her ITC right now. Um, her instructor exam is going to be, uh, when we get back from our fundraiser in November, but, um, she, uh, she's like our, our videographer. So she's on every dive. Um, we typically have a dive master or assistant instructor with us as well. And we keep our, our ratios four to one. Um, we never go over that. Uh, I did one, two standards at eight to one, one time. And I will never do that again. Um, I thought I was going to die. That was so much work and trying to do eight students by yourself. Oh man, is it a workout? And that was regular. That was just regular open water. Um, so we keep our classes and our trips very small. Um, the intimacy is something that I think sets us apart. Um, I always try to keep it like fire team elements. You know, you can, you can, you can get much closer with a smaller group of people. You can learn more about each other. Uh, and you can keep those diving situations a heck of a lot more control. And, you know, well within standards very easily, especially if you have two extra bodies to help. So, um, that's typically how we do it as far as what, what the, I would say the adaptive and regular divers faces is basically a mental block, you know, everybody's got this fear of the ocean. Um, fear of breathing underwater, fear of the unknown. Um, and again, once you see them overcome that, it's a sense of joy. You see in somebody that's just amazing to experience with them, but not only experience it with them, you're the one that introduced that to them. Like they're, they're, they're accomplishing not only physical hurdles, but, but huge mental ones as well. I mean, I, you know, I, I have friends and family that are like, you're crazy. I, you know, I can't believe you, you do the scuba diving, you know, and you can kill yourself scuba diving if you don't follow the rules. I mean, it's, it's a dangerous sport. It can be dangerous if you're not doing what you know, you're, you're supposed to do, um, but as long as you stay within, you know, what you taught, never hold your breath, you don't, you don't go past, you know, decompression, you don't go past anything on recreational. Um, depth limits or, or, or, you know, if you're diving nitrox max operating depth, chances are, you're not going to have a problem. You're going to, you're, you're going to live a long fulfilling life experiencing amazing things underwater. Um, and I just started getting into free diving and I told myself years ago, I'm never touching that no way that's super dangerous, you know, and I'm freaking hooked now, like I am, I, I've, I needed this, you know, I love scuba diving. I, I, it's, it's, you know, the most incredible thing ever, but the, the mental hurdle that I have now accomplished inside my own head with free diving, I can't tell you, Benjamin, how, how much that has changed me just in the short time I started and I just started, um, you know, and one of our instructors, uh, Joe, um, he, he's been hounding me for two years now. We should do free dive. And I was like, no, we're not doing it. No, we're not doing it. And, uh, they had the, the world, um, the world championship here in roads and this last August. And I got to, you know, meet, uh, like Alexi motion of, and, um, uh, Mariana Giuseppe that, you know, top tier free diving in the world. So I started kind of picking their brain on it. Um, uh, Johnny, one of the U S team competitors, he stayed at my house. Um, cause he had reached out to us about, about doing free diving as well as scuba for therapy. And I, and, and it started piquing my interest. So now I'm kind of trying it and it looks like that's something that we're going to bring into our mission as well for the veterans want to, to push themselves a little bit harder physically. Um, cause it's a workout. It is definitely a workout, but it provides the same mental, like you, you have, you get forced into the present moment. There's no, you know, I don't know if you experienced that or if you're, if you're cognizant of when you experienced it, you do technical stuff, which scares me, I, I, the, the depth on technical, I, it creeps me out, but, um, you know, a good friend of mine, Andy, who actually taught my, my ITC, uh, Andy Egan, he, he's, he's a big tech guy. And, um, you know, he keeps trying to tell me, he's like, look, man, once you get past that, it's no different, you know, than, than like probably the mental block I had on three. Um, you know, you just, you gotta, you got to push yourself at some point to, to really see what you can do. Um, so I think that's probably what, what the adaptive and regular, you know, scuba community goes through, um, as the biggest kind of hurdle they have to push themselves to, to, to do. I, I would agree with that. You got to come over to the technical with us. I, next time we come down, we'll have to, we'll do, we'll do a little, uh, talking about that and see if we can't move you into the realm. You know, you know, Will, right? Will Fox? Yes. Yeah. So he was, he was one of my, so Will Fox and Kirk Stolzenberg were my instructors for the, for my, my trainer. And, uh, Will did talk me into the decompression diving. So I have that, I have that, uh, that course material in my, my account. Uh, at some point I got to get down to Key Largo and do that with him. So he did twist my arm to, to start dipping my toes. I don't, I don't, I don't know. We'll see. I think that's going to be a long process. I, I, I struggle with the math so bad and there's a lot of math in that. Um, you know, the math is really actually pretty easy. I really, it's the, the key with, I'll tell you that the two keys with, with technical diving is first the mental strength to do it. Um, because you have to have mental patience and mental strength to want to put, to want to do that. And the second one is the configuration of getting into that good hover and that good trim, so you can stop and do nothing and you're okay doing 45 minutes on a deco soft, just watching fish go by and it really is about it. It develops your technique. I watched my open water divers that move eventually move into tech. Um, their form changes completely from the time they start to the time I get them in attack. And I, I like to get my assistant instructors and instructors into tech quickly because it changes their form and they become amazing looking open water instructors. That's for sure. It's fantastic. So that's my, my pitch on it for you for the day, but let's jump back to this. So with, uh, with classified diving, what are some of the key skills that you teach that you've learned through the process? Give me one, give me one or two good skills as I'm teaching classified diving. How do I need to teach it? What's a key skill that you were like, yeah, I've got to teach that. So I took a, a deaf blind, um, non-military. He, he, he found us on, you know, Google or something. He came in on a cruise ship and, um, he said, you know, I'm, I'm deaf blind. He had a scuba diver cert from, from Patty. I don't know how he had that, but, um, he did have it. And, uh, he said, will you, will you take me, take me for a dive? This is before I did any kind of classified training, right? I'm like, you know what? I'll take anybody diving. Like I let's do it. Right. And we just did a little short dive, you know, I think. Max steps like 20 feet. Um, I don't know if you've been to Rotan, but the Manny Joe garden, you know, you've got like a, basically a 20 foot swim out to the wall. Um, and, uh, 20 feet deep. That is it's a, it's about a two or 300 yard swim, but, um, he had an interpreter or a sign language, um, interpreter and he did tactile sign language. So, I mean, my whole, my mind was blown. I just watching this right now. And in my core, I just want to help you. So this was like my first introduction to the adaptive side, deaf and blind. And, uh, you know, I just, I kind of, I jump into things, you know, really nearly, but, um, his interpreter couldn't equal it, she couldn't get down. And I'm sitting there kind of my hand on his shoulder. I'm going to him, you know, but her and going, what's going on? I don't know sign language. And, uh, you know, he's just sitting there waiting patiently. Okay. So I, you know, do the okay sign and stick my hand in his hand. He says, okay. Right. Maybe try this. Like you want to swim and he says, okay. So we start swimming, right. And we just kind of do circles and she stayed above us and watched. And I had a, one of the dive shop managers. He's also an instructor, Claudio with us. And so it was basically like a two on one there. And we just kind of swam in circles and we found like, uh, you know, a conch shell that he could feel. Um, there's a, there's kind of like a, uh, what do you call it? Like a guideline rope that goes all the way out for people to follow. And, uh, you know, he got to feel that, um, found some, some kind of empty seashells, have him feel that he came back and he said at the time of his life. So as far as classified skills go, understanding what it's like to be blind was like after taking somebody with no, no comprehension of what he was feeling. The, the, the blind diver portion of the classified is huge. I mean, when you, when you do the, you know, the total blackout mask and your underwater breathing, like it's, it's such a weird sensation in your body. Um, and then, you know, you know, you do the clear, uh, clear skirt for like a partial blind where you get some kind of light coming in and out, but the mask is still blacked out. Um, for me, that was, that was probably one of my favorite. Um, learning experiences was because I kind of had prior knowledge of taking somebody, um, but had no idea what they might be feeling. So when you're doing that, um, or when you're doing like, uh, uh, when you're guiding somebody who, who might be paralyzed, you know, you need to know how to manipulate them in a way that, you know, you're not just clobbering them, but everything is a nice and slow and controlled, um, movements. Right. And again, you're going to get people that might not like you being too handy where if, if they can use their arms to swim, you know, you use the web gloves. So, you know what that that's like and how exhausting that can be. Um, just from, you know, going from like kicking or, or frog kicking to trying to propel yourself because you're, you're, you're paralyzed from the waist down by doing a breaststroke. Um, it's exhausting. So you, you have to keep in mind that you can't, um, you know, you can't just start kicking like you normally would. Like you really have to slow yourself down. And I, I think that's one of the best things that you learn, um, especially as an instructor, when you, when you go through the classified courses is how slow you need to go. Um, you know, you're not, you're not just, you know, everybody gets into that kind of complacency, right? Like open water, one, two, three, four, you know, confined water and all this stuff, and you just, you, you just kind of go like a template, but classified kind of throws a kink into that. And it, and it, it allows you to start really kind of thinking about how divers might react in a different way. I didn't think that's changed your general open water skill, uh, teaching ability and teaching, uh, methods. Uh, if you ask my wife, she says I'm the most patient individual while I'm teaching outside of that, not so much. Um, no, it's, I, this has changed my life. I mean, I, I have no problems admitting, you know, I, I had issues, you know, I was, like I said, I was a raging alcoholic, which controlled my life and I made a lot of bad decisions and, and, you know, that was heavily anchored with my PTSD, um, you know, and it's therapy for me when I, when I get to help my brothers and sisters that saw combat and get to teach them a skillset that they never thought of before, because I don't know, scuba has a bad name, depending on who you talk to, right. You know, somebody might've lost a relative and I, you know, and I feel terrible for the families that, you know, of people who have had scuba accidents. Um, but you know, they're, they're avoidable and that scares a lot of people and, and you get over that mental hurdle and you see them progress. It's changed my life significantly. I've, I went from being a selfish jerk, you know, that only cared about myself to wanting nothing, but, but to, to, to show the underwater world to as many people as I possibly can, especially veterans, um, because I've seen firsthand what it does, not only to myself, but you know, we, we've had, we've had over 150 veterans come through our program in the past four years, um, that it's changed their lives too, you know, some, some like it, but they don't, you know, they don't really progress in it. It's, it's kind of like a, oh, that's cool. I have that, you know, if I ever go on vacation, I'll use it. And then when you have the other guys that just freaking run straight into it, like, oh, this is my, my new favorite thing. And, you know, they're, I, one of the guys that, that came through our course in, um, geez, was it, uh, June or July? Um, he just sent me an email saying that he's, his entire life has changed. He's, he's gotten off all of his medication from the VA. Um, and he's actually going on a liveaboard trip in like two weeks, you know, and, and I was like, that's incredible, man, like you're, you're, you're going on like a, you know, that's a, that's a dedicated diver trip. You know, regular divers don't do liveaboard trips. I mean, A the price, but B it's, it's, it's an all, it's an all a card, all you can die. Like you're going to meet some serious divers, man, pay attention, you know, have conversations with them, like real pick their brain. You're going to love every minute of this. And, and he told me, he's like, that's what I want. Like, you've changed my life. I want to get my dive master. I want to work to instructor and I want to help this, this mission with veterans as well. Like I've tried everything and I've never been able to get out of my rut. I've never been able to get off my meds. I've never been able to just feel like I'm not suffocating all the time. And scuba has allowed that in my life. And I've heard this dozens of times, you know, people that are on their last leg of just every day, they're just trying to find something to keep them alive. Right. Something. And they come through our program and it completely changes their life. And it's one week, one week of scuba, you know, we got to go. It's go, go, go. I mean, we're, we're 14 dives. I mean, it's as, as long as we, we can be underwater, we will. Um, you know, they get the best sleep of their lives here. Cause they're just so exhausted from breathing with compressed gas. I know, you know what that's like? Um, you know, a week of diving, even on nitrox, you're smoked. You are just, I mean, you're sleeping better than ever, but, um, you know, that was one of the most recent, uh, kind of, I don't know, just it, that makes me feel so happy, I helping others to, to get out of that rut because I know what that and, and I know how difficult it is. And, and everybody's different. Everybody has, everybody has their limits. Everybody has what works for them. I'm not saying that, you know, scuba is the end all be all fix all, but it's something that's so different that it has this, this side effect of being able to, you know, to, to snap people out of that rut long enough to start thinking and it's, I don't know, in his case, that is a, that is a drastic change, right? You know, I would love to get every veteran off, off the medication that, you know, I've got to stay away from the political side of this, but the VA sucks. Like, I don't think I could say that enough. Um, and we're going to be talking to Congress and Senate relatively soon to try and get some changes made on the VA side because, um, I'm sick of it. And, uh, you know, they, they put us in their newsletter three years ago and we had 2,500 veterans apply in 12 hours. Um, which is why we had to create the purple heart rule. Um, before that it was, it was any veteran could come. Um, and we still have over 400 veterans on a wait list and the VA hasn't given us a dime, a dime. Not even a penny. And we got Congress involved, uh, last year for the adaptive sports grant. And they said, oh, well, it's because you're, you're bringing veterans outside the United States. Okay. So we changed now we're operating out of Florida. We're operating out of Gilboa quarry up in Ohio. We're operating, um, pretty much anywhere we can in the U S. And we got denied again this year and I'm waiting for the reason why. And once we get the reason why, um, I'm probably going to be going nuclear about it to, to get some changes made because it's, it's, it's, it's angering. Um, but you know, in my personal experience with the VA, this is not, you know, a political statement. It's the second you get in there. Oh, here, here's medication. Take these. Okay. Like, do I get to talk to somebody first? No. Just take these. You know, I've had friends that had to wait over a year to talk to a therapist and they were like this close from killing themselves and they had to wait a year just to see a therapist in the VA. And then once you see it, then they rotate the therapist and then you get a new one. So you have to start over. So you finally build a rapport with the therapist you might like and feel comfortable with, and then the VA says, okay, now you're going to see this. You can start all over again. So I get the, the, the wonderful experience of trying to do all that from Honduras and, um, that just adds a whole nother layer of catastrophe to it. So, um, yeah, the, the most recent, uh, uh, issue with us with the VA is, is, you know, we got denied the adaptive sports grant again, which, you know, there's no reason why we shouldn't. They do, they do provide, um, much smaller organizations with grants or and that don't have a 400 veteran waitlist that they created and they're giving that money up. So I, I, I don't know what the reasoning is, but I'm, um, after four years of denials or three years of denial since the article, um, our board has finally said, okay, enough, we have to, we have to fight. So, uh, hopefully we're going to get some changes made inside that. But you know, if you talk to any of your veteran friends, you know, I'm not sure what, what, what your situation is with the VA, but you know, nine times out of 10, it's here to take these meds. And if we can start getting these people off the meds so they can think clearly for once, that's a huge win in my book. And obviously you have to do it the right way. You can't just, you can't just rip people off medication because side effects are through the roof, but. Um, the people that do it the right way, see, see huge changes in their lives so fast. Nick, what can we do to support warfighter scuba to continue its mission? Um, you can donate on our website. We're, we're a 501c3. We are a U S nonprofit, so it is a tax deductible, uh, warfighterscuba.org forward slash donate. You can go there. Um, you know, you can, you can donate there. We have a fundraiser coming up in dripping Springs, Texas at hog heaven on a veteran's day, November. I always, I always say November 10th, but it's November 11th. I get the Marine Corps birthday, you know, and everything confused. Um, so it's Saturday, November 11th. It's running from 10 AM to 8 PM. We're going to be doing some sporting clay shoots. Um, we have, uh, some Navy seals doing some pistol training that you come out and learn some pistol training. All proceeds go to the mission from that. And then we have some really cool silent auction items. Um, so if you're in the Texas area or you want to fly out for that, that's, that's an option, um, as well, as far as like, you know, directly contributing Um, next year we're planning on a huge year. Uh, my, my goal is to get a hundred veterans through next year. We did. I think we did about 54 this year. I want to try and double that next year. That's amazing. So Nick, we all have that student. Um, that, uh, it was our, kind of our prior student where we had made the biggest impact on their life. Um, one of mine, I was in a positive way. Okay. Sorry. I, mine was, I was teaching this last season, which I know this is completely foreign to you. But I had a student, as soon as he got his, his gear off, he jumped up, ran over and hugged me and said, this is the greatest experience of my life. And so, you know, that one always stands out as well, but tell me about your, your most heartwarming experience. It just, you can't get out of your head. You're like, wow, I touched this person positively. And it's probably my first amputee that came through our program. Um, his name is Jay and he's, he's become a very, very close friend of mine. I love him to death. Um, and, uh, I, I, you know, when you're teaching, you're very good at reading people, right. And, and the whole mental, like I'm scared of the water. I'm scared of this. He thought he was controlling that very well. I mean, his eyes are this big. I mean, and so we're in the pool and we're going through and I can say, okay, this guy's got, he's a little worried about the water. Did great on all the skills that are, you know, absolutely phenomenal. Get out to open water, crush the skills again. And, and we start getting into just, you know, really fine tuning buoyancy, fine tuning his kick. He's a right leg amputee at the hip. So he has no ability for a prosthetic for swimming. Um, so we started out with the web gloves. Uh, he hated those and I taught him the mermaid kick and. When he got that down, I saw his, I saw his light just shine, you know, like the light bulb went off and he was, I need a leash for him every time we dive together. I need a freaking leash for him because he is such a mad man and he's free and he's just like, he won't slow down. He's so excited to be mobile because when he walks, he has to carry a backpack with batteries that like ridiculous amounts of batteries to replace the power, right. And, and that was just like my, I knew what we did help, but that was the most, you know, just sitting back and going, huh? Like I I'm speechless still to this day. And then, um, he came back again with another group of veterans and we did the perfect points, right? You know, we had the little square up, um, that son of a gun, you know, he did better than me and I'm the instructor and he's, you know, he's got one leg and he's doing everything perfect and flips and, and, and loops and, and, uh, it's just, he, that one will always, I think be the best of, of like, wow moments. You know what I mean? Um, I've had quite a few, you know, same thing like, oh my God, you've changed my life and hugged me. And, but I think that the first one is the one that always sticks the most. Um, and, uh, you know, we, we stay in touch with all of our veterans. Like we, um, we have, uh, a Facebook group that's closed to people who only come through our program. Admittedly, I need to get better at getting everybody in there. I'm so bad at social media. Um, but you know, we're, we're trying to grow a network and, and make this a continuous thing. And that's going to be one of the big things next year is now that we're, we're starting off in, you know, in Florida or in Gilboa, um, there's a dive park in Dallas that we might start using, but to, to, to, to come back to row a tan and have, you know, do some more advanced stuff, you know, cause trying to squeeze everything in here in a week and yeah, it's great. For, for training, but I think it's better for the veterans to get a more realistic experience. You know what I mean? Where they're starting off. Not top five dive destinations in the world. You go to, you know, Florida is still great. I went to Pompano and dive in the wrecks. There was a heck of a lot easier than doing the wrecks here. Cause all the wrecks here, you know, a hundred, 110 feet. So it's a much more advanced dive. Um, we get to play on one of them. I think it's a lady luck or something. Played on that for like almost 40 minutes and, you know, didn't even come close to Deco or anything. It was just incredible. You go down to L Aguila or, or Odyssey, you know, 10, 12 minutes. It's like, okay, we got to go. Um, and it's, uh, I don't know. It's going to be cool to start bringing like a reunion trip. Right. So we're going to try and do large groups, like 10 to 12 veterans. And then Joe and Adam and myself will be in the water with them to keep four to one. But we can all do, you know, the veterans will get to meet other veterans. And, you know, I love it when I get to see Joe and Adam that they're, they're great. Um, you know, they joined us two years ago as instructors and, um, it's just, we're, we're going to, we're a cool little family and I'm hoping you get to come out and dive with us, um, and, and become a part of that as well. Uh, it's, it's, I don't know. It's, it's, it's, it's for the first time in my life, I've created something that works. That's all I can say. I mean, I've screwed up so many things in my life and this is just something that, that, that works and is, is growing and we're creating like a movement inside the veteran community. That's just amazing. Um, you know, it's, it's, it's just wonderful. So, yeah, I don't know. I'm, I'm rambling again. I just, I'm so excited. I so much excitement about it. That's awesome. So let's dig back into the course just a little bit and then, um, kind of close out, but Nick dive scenarios and problem solving exercises are often part of how the open water course works. How can you with new adaptive as with new adaptive students, prepare them to handle these situations effectively? Yeah. I mean, Q and a beforehand expectations. I, you know, I always, I always talk to the students and the veterans, like, what do you expect? Um, it's a good way to read what they might be having issues with. Um, especially on the adaptive side, you know, that every, every adaptive individual is going to have different needs or different circumstances that you need to be aware of. Um, so definitely having like, you know, good knowledge of, of your, your students or veterans beforehand and what their expectations are. Um, communication's key, you know, if you're not communicating, somebody's probably gonna get hurt, um, just trying to force something through. Um, you know, the, the, the boat diving on the adaptive side, we don't have anything with like a, what do you call it? A David or like a crane. So we got to use the slings. And some, sometimes, you know, um, all the boats at infinity are, uh, platform boats, so it's giant stride entries, um, and ladder exits where, you know, sometimes the platform's pretty high. I try to get the lower one, you know, if we have anybody that we need to sling in, obviously, cause it makes it a lot easier. Um, but I, you know, also, you know, transfers from wheelchairs onto the boat kind of thing. So that, I mean, that's typically where I'm really worried. Um, once we get in the water, not so much. I mean, especially if they're telling me what, what they're comfortable with. Um, but communication beforehand is probably the most important part. Fantastic. So we all, as instructors, we all have our favorite little games we played during open water to teach skills. I have my students, for example, build cairns underwater. I've had them five rocks and, and stack them to help them teach buoyancy. Or I'll have, uh, we'll play games where I'll take an egg down. That's, uh, uh, been boiled and it's not been boiled at the surface. Right. And, uh, All right. I actually, um, but we play our own little games as we go along. What, what individual unique games have you learned to play with your adaptive divers that are kind of fun that, but teach a lesson at the same time? Uh, I don't, I don't think we really play any games to be honest with you. It's just, I working on buoyancy is big, but it's mainly, I kind of do like a follow the leader type. You know, I, I, I show them and then we sit there and we practice it. Um, when we get into like, do, if we bust out the perfect buoyancy and, you know, I set up a course like that, that's kind of when the fun starts. Right. I mean, that's why I started laughing when you said, you know, everybody's got that one student. Um, I used to be able to teach, you know, the free-flowing regulator as this is something you'll probably never see in your life, but this is how you can overcome it. Right. Well, I can't say that anymore because I had a Marine that, uh, now is part of my course every time I teach the free-flowing regulator, because we, I set up like, uh, you know, the, the tank banger, the lobster tickler. So I'll run a line and, um, at the end of it, it'll just kind of be sitting out of the sand like this, right. And I want them to purge the regulator without using their hands gently. This guy in true Marine form. I mean, I swear he was like sprinting straight vertically down to hit it as hard as he could. It actually was enough force that pushed the, the, the valve, you know, the little leaf spring all the way back. So it started a free-flow and I'm holding it. Just like shaking my head, like holding my regulator out for him to take it. I'm laughing so hard. He's laughing. He's forgetting to take my regulator. I'm like shaking it in his face. It's just so yeah. Uh, I mean, we play games like that mainly on the, on the buoyancy course. Um, but a lot of times, you know, we, we've got so much stuff. It's hard to haul it down when we're down on that shore dive. Um, I don't know if you've ever been to infinity, but it's like a, it's like a 300 yard walk with gear and everything. So, um, you know, I would love to have like torpedoes and things like that. It's just, it's, it's, it's always a nightmare trying to get the gear down there and I'm one of those people that likes to have everything set correctly. So there's no distractions. Um, but, uh, you know, the, I guess the game part, you know, when you're doing the classified dive buddy, when you're learning the blind diver stuff, that's usually pretty funny, um, when you're, you're completely dependent on somebody else and it just, you know, you're, you're, you look so stiff, like, Oh, I don't know what I'm doing. Um, and trying to get them relaxed on that part, but yeah, I, maybe I should start implementing that. I never thought of, of, of doing games. You know, we don't, we don't have any rocks we can stack without, you know, probably Nick, finally, what advice would you give anyone interested in pursuing a similar path in diving with, as an adaptive instructor? Uh, go for it. I mean, I, it's different and, and you'll, you'll end up taking different things away from it that might help you teach regular open water or, or advanced or, or different specialties because you're, you're presented with different. Circumstances that you have to adapt to. I mean, it's, it's a great way to, to increase your ability to teach. Um, when you get out of that cookie cutter, everything's typically the same kind of mentality. And I like the, I like the idea of games. I got to, I'm going to have to figure that out because we don't do anything like that. And that would probably help significantly. It's definitely fun to break it up with a little humor. My, I have a few favorites. Um, one of them is I have two sizes of Canada Snickers candy bars, a mini and a full size, and at the surface, I show them a full size candy Snickers candy bar. And then I put it in my pocket. I says, what will it look like when we get to depth? And then I pull out of my pocket, the mini pot, the mini one. I says, look how small it is. And then when I get back to the surface, I show them the big one again. Um, I, I I'll take it, uh, two eggs. I'll take one that's, uh, um, hard boiled and one that's fresh, uh, fresh. And at the surface I'll crack it and say, okay, so I've got two eggs here. This one's and, and it's regular. What happens to a regular egg? If we take it to the surf or to the depth, um, and, uh, um, get, uh, uh, pressure on it with boils law, will it boil it and get hot? And so I take it down, I crack it. It's a hard boiled egg, you know? And so we have little things like that. Just say you're, you're messing with them. I get it. I have a little bit of fun with it and get them, get them to thinking. The goal is to get them thinking. But I, I also like the idea of making them stack Karens, um, and, uh, make things that stacking was, uh, stacking rocks, they call it building Karens. Um, but you take Aaron, I learned it. Um, I went to a, uh, uh, to blue hair or to blue grotto. And I was doing an instructor course there as part of the instructor course. We, we stacked rocks one on top of the other, but the object is you can only touch it with one hand. You can't touch anything else and you have to remain in buoyancy. So you have to pick up a rock, set it on top of another rock and then come back. And then you have to pick up the rock, another rock and see how high you can build them. Huh? Go wonder. Yeah, I would have to do that. Well, it's fun. All we have is reef. So yeah, I'd have to, like, I'd have to make something artificial there for sure. But I want to do that. Cause I, yeah, I've seen people with the torpedoes and things like that, you know, that, that work to help with buoyancy. And I would love to, I would love to implement something like that to make it a little bit less. Hey, watch me now you do it, you know, fun things to break up the course. You're right. And, and I mess with them a little bit through the course, but get them thinking, you know, what would happen to this? And at the end, we tell them, you know, it was a hard boiled egg. We got down, but they get to thinking, what would happen to an egg if I took it down? Well, that's certainly frustrating. Anyway, sorry about that. Well, Nick, we'll go ahead and wrap this up, Nick. Thank you so much for coming on and, and working with and talking with us today. I appreciate you greatly. Yeah. Thanks for having me, man. I hope we can dive soon. I'm, I'm definitely looking forward to it and try and get back to Honduras. I've, I've dove all the places you've talked about and I've loved them all. The lady luck is one of our favorite dives and, um, as well. And we've done plenty of time on the, the luck as well. So I hope to see you soon. Well, guys, if you can go to warfighter scuba, check out their website, donate. If you can, it's a great cause. We're helping veterans that have gone through a process. They've been wounded in action somehow to get a purple heart. It's not a, it's not an award. We, you know, when the core, we always jokingly called it the enemy marksmanship badge, it means it's something bad happened to them. Because they were in combat for us. They've lost a limb, an arm, something they've, they've taken damage, damage personally for us. Right, Nick, thank you for your service as well, by the way. And, um, I've just take the time, go to their Facebook page, support them in any way you can. Again, if you like this kind of content, go to teach me to dive. Make sure you hit smash that like button and the subscribe button. Cause we want you to come in and see amazing guys like Nick. Now, Nick, if you wouldn't mind, I'd like to do a follow-up with you in a few months as well. See where you're at and see what we can do. And if we helped you in some way. Yeah, of course. Anytime you want me on, I'm happy to be here. Nick. I appreciate you. Thank you so much. All right. Thanks Benjamin.