What Becoming the Outsider Teaches About Identity and Purpose

What if the greatest lesson of your life came from becoming the outsider? What if everything you believe about identity, belonging, immigration, and even yourself changed simply because you were forced to start over in a place where no one spoke your language? Today's conversation may completely change how you see people and yourself. Welcome to Keeping It Real On Purpose, where real conversations create real transformation. I'm your host, Edna White, bestselling author, keynote speaker, and life purpose strategist. Every episode, we go beyond surface conversation to uncover patterns, perspectives, and purpose that help us grow personally and professionally. Today's guest is award-winning author, Janet Flower, whose memoir, Two Bottles of Water, chronicles an unforgettable 18 months she and her husband spent living in Beijing after she accepted the position of superintendent at an international school. Her journey is funny, emotionally, well-opening. I'm really messing it up today, guys. Eye-opening and filled with lessons that extend far beyond travel. Together, we're exploring identity, belonging, culture shock, unconscious bias, resilience, and what happens when you become a stranger. Let's get into it. Welcome to the show. Thank you so much, Edna. I appreciate you having me. I am excited because when I read your book, I was like, oh my goodness, this is not about the two bottles of water. This is about what I went through. I was so excited to know that you lived in Beijing. I was like, yay! I met somebody who's done that. I love it, I love it, I love it. I'm so excited to have you on, and I wanna just jump right into it. When was your first, when you first arrived in Beijing, what was the biggest misconception you carried that reality completely shattered? Oh, I think that, and this is all Hollywood-based, all Chinese people are very small. They cannot be farther from the truth. I heard that, too. Totally shocked. I was like, yeah, no. That person looks like they're six feet. Yes, yes. I had a student that was only 15, and he was 6'2", and I was like, you're supposed to be small, and he's like, nope, and they're not, and another one is that everyone looked the same. They absolutely do not. No, absolutely not. So silly, right? We hear silly things like that that kind of get in our perception, you know? It really gets in our perception, and then we go there, and it's like we're totally shocked. Absolutely, and of course, you're too young to have heard this, but I can remember watching old movies, and there was always something in there about the Chinese mind is inscrutable, and so that's what you go thinking, and I thought, you know, they'll be very closed. They're not. They're open, and just like everybody else, but I would say that my experience was that Chinese people are reserved and maybe cautious with newcomers, but when you get to know people and scratch away that veneer that we all have, gosh, they're just like you. Absolutely, they are. They are. Yeah, isn't it funny how we simply carry around these perceptions about folks, like people, things, and when we carry them around, growth doesn't happen, you know, and with this bad information, because you imagine both of us if we would have kept that same perception in our minds. Yes, well said. Growth doesn't happen. It doesn't take much. You know, it's a risky thing. I shouldn't say it doesn't take much, Edna. You know and I know it's a little bit of a risk to put yourself out there with people who you're unfamiliar with, who you're not sure will like you or be nice to you or whatever. It just takes a little bit, and I've had the experience in my lifetime. I was a teacher for many years. I used to drag students everywhere. I was a Spanish teacher, and I felt every opportunity that I could provide for them where they would be exposed to the culture, exposed to the language, exposed to the people was a growthful experience, and it's very nice when you're in that situation because you've got your backup, you've got your mom to run to. You know, if you get nervous, I was always there, but the opportunity for them to get out and meet other people in other countries or even in the United States, I think helped them to grow so much as people. I was delighted to see that in my kiddos. Yeah, I know as a teacher, you're probably like it was the highlight of life. It was great. Yes, yeah, of course. During that experience that you had in Beijing, what's a belief that forced you to rethink? What's a belief that you had that forced you to rethink something? What forced me to rethink it? That's a good question. Well, I think the initial feeling that I was worried, I think, about the government and the government's oversight of people and some on people. And although I did experience a lot of that, people were still not, they were definitely not as downtrodden as I pictured that they must be. Poor people with such a mean government, they have lots of freedoms to do and go where they want to go. And that was a big learning curve for me. I didn't expect that, but it was wonderful to be able to just chat with people off the cuffs and get to meet them. That's one of the things too that when I left, and I left late in life, I was nearly 40, maybe 42, somewhere in there. And when I went, everyone's telling me, oh, they do this and they do that. But I was like, I was concerned, but I wasn't because I got on the plane. So it was like, but I was concerned, but I wasn't. And then, and I didn't know when I got there, I had to sleep 24 hours because I was tired. It's tiring traveling that far. But when I woke up, I looked out the window and I went in February. So I got there in February. And when I went, the trees are just blooming from spring and all that good stuff. And so I'm looking out the window and said, man, I'm by myself, like really by myself. Like there's nobody I can turn to that, if something happens, I'm really by myself. I gotta figure this out. In an instant like that, did you have that experience? Did you like, I know you were with your husband, but did you have like the shock of it all? Yes, I think so. And I will say, because I was the head of an American school, an international school, I had a safe place to go. But outside of that, when you're out in the culture, we were on our own pretty much. And so I resorted at first because my Chinese was very poor until we hired somebody to help train us. I would have to resort to written notes from my administrative assistant that would tell us, for example, a cab driver, where I needed to go. Please take this lady, don't leave her. And so that was unnerving because you get in a cab with somebody and you are trusting that this person is going to take you where you wanna go. And I have to say, and I don't know if you experienced this, I was never afraid to be accosted in Beijing. Me neither, never. Never. I didn't think about that. I didn't go frequent scary places, but nevertheless, I knew that I was pretty safe. One, because here again, the government comes in. They did not want people harassing foreigners. So I know that helps a bit. But also because I don't know, I think sometimes when you trust, like you got on the plane and you went there, so you kind of reached out and a little bit of trust there. And I think people respond to that when you're nice and pleasant and trying to do the right thing and trying to say the words right or whatever it is. Yeah, they would laugh. They laugh when you're good. Yes, they laughed when I tried the first time. And like you said, I made my roommate, I was like, write everything. She was there, she was there two years. So I was like, write everything. I need to get back to this address, write it out for me. I was like a little kid. I had like these cards, I was like turning around and letting them see it. Really, I was like, I was intense on learning. I really wanted to learn some of the words, which I did. And I learned just enough to get where I need to go. I was taking the bus, I was going downtown to the gym. It was like a regular, after a while it became like regular routine. So being in a small village or town, people get to know you like, oh, I know what you're coming in here for there. And they get it ready for you, going grocery shopping, for instance, those types of things. But it feels good. Like you said that the government makes sure that we're not harassed, that feels good. But it also goes to, that was your assignment, and you're gonna be protected, having that just that confidence that nothing was gonna happen to you, especially when you stay in your purpose. And I know your purpose and your husband's purpose is to go there and be the superintendent, right? Right. We did have some experiences that were scary because at the beginning, it was at the beginning of when cell phones were starting to be used. And so I had a cell phone, it was about the size of a brick, and it was enormous, a giant thing. Yeah, the biggest, yes, I know what you're talking about. But I had no numbers to call. I didn't know anybody's number. So, but we had gone to a market that we had heard about called the Russian market. And we went there, it was a huge, three huge consonants. And we were in there, and I realized pretty quickly that we spoke virtually no Chinese, and the people in there spoke virtually no English. And so it was just working it out, trying to work it out. And my husband suddenly vanished. And I searched up and down the aisles looking for him and calling to him. And I heard kind of a kerfuffle in the back of the room, and that made me nervous. And so I'm yelling and no answer. I walked clear back to the front of the market. I'm looking there. I'm thinking, well, I have a cell phone that I don't know a single phone number. So that's useless. So I walk all the way back, and I'm searching, and I'm calling, and he does not respond. And I thought, he's been kidnapped. And all of a sudden I hear this voice, Jan, I'm right here. I was so relieved because I was terrified. I thought, there is nothing I can do. There is no one I can contact, and no one here understands what I'm saying. But thank goodness he just was not paying attention. Yeah, kind of was enthralled with something. You're just going, you think of all the worst things that could possibly happen. Yes, yes, yes. But in the end it was okay. Do you think that's part of the culture? Do you think that's part of culture shock that we're like really scared that something's gonna happen? Or is that just us being us? I think a little bit of that is an unrealized bias. Because I think I had a bias inside of me saying, oh, something bad could happen in China. The Chinese might be really terrible people. It's not true. It's not true, but you go there. You go there when you're scared. Yeah. Which is a stupid way to go. Absolutely, absolutely, it is. I think I had to relinquish all of those biases. You know, as one thing they told me, oh, they're communists, they're communists. I'm like, okay. You know, that's why I said they're communists. They kept saying it. So, you know, in my mind, instead of looking it up and figuring it out, I'm like, okay, communism, that reminds me of Hitler. You know, all this stuff. I'm saying, what? And when I got there, it was totally different. I was like, wait, what's going on? So I had to relinquish a lot of that. And a lot of the things that they thought about us, because they know that there's African Blacks, then there's American Blacks. So they know the difference, right? They know. And I had students, I had small kids. You know, I had from five to about 15. So I had different classes. So one kid, you know, and my, you know, one kid walked up to me and she licked me and she went like this. And so she told me, I had a teacher's assistant who spoke Chinese. And she goes, she said, you don't taste like chocolate. And I was like, no, I don't taste like chocolate. Tastes like a person. But it was so funny. It was like, that was like, like we learned from each other that, wait, that's, you know, even with my other students, they came in, they were teenagers. So they would give me a pound. And one of them said the N word to me. And I was like, looked at them, said, where did you learn that from? He said, oh, I learned it from watching Jay-Z and, you know, on the videos. I said, that's not a good word. And he started crying. I mean, here's this guy, 6'2". Look, he's a kid still, 15 years old. He broke down crying. And the students were like, they were like all like, they were so sorry. Like, well, we're really sorry. And I'm like, no, it's okay. They didn't know that it's not an appropriate word. They didn't know, you know? And they were saying this to me, like, it was cool. And I was like, no, it's okay. And he was so upset that he brought his parents in. And they were begging my apologies. And I said, it's all right. I get it. You know, that they're, and it was a learning experience for both cultures. But just let me know that even I had biases, you know, because if I would have heard that word in New York, it would have been a whole nother story. But you know what I'm saying? Like, okay, I get it. This is really, it was really a learning experience, especially around biases. It is. What did you say, Jane? Oh, I'm sorry. I was afraid you froze up again. I was just saying, yes, it is. I thought that. Yeah, yeah. Having grown up with immigrants in my background. Yes. From all over the place. I was used to having people who talked a little bit differently, looked a little bit different in my own upbringing. So I think it was easy for me to simply accept who was out there that I was being exposed to and being involved with. And that didn't bother me to have those kinds of differences. But I can see a person who has never had that kind of exposure being really uncomfortable. And until you take that first step around your own ego and just say, you know what? I want to meet you. I want to talk to you. I want to learn about you. You cut yourself off from being able to learn about different people. And we had such wonderful experiences with people that we were involved with. Positive experiences, learning a lot about them, learning a lot about the culture, being invited into people's homes. Even the taxi drivers who were a hoot, I'll tell you. I absolutely loved them. Yeah, funny, very funny, yeah. They were a lot of fun to be around. And they would even help you learn. I remember in my own effort to learn Chinese, all of the staff in my school, the school we taught in English, but we also taught the children Chinese. And we taught them that because they're living in China and who knows how long they're gonna live there. They should know how to work out things in the language. So everybody had been told, Janet, Dr. Flahert wants to be sure that everybody feels comfortable with saying Chinese words to her and teaching her words in Chinese because it will help her greatly. And I remember my head custodian, Mr. Shin, we called him Shin Shu Fu. And the man could have built a human heart out of wood, I believe this. He was incredible. But he spoke almost zero English. And at the beginning, I spoke almost zero Chinese. And he would every now and then go buy two sweet potatoes, off the racks that they had out on the streets. And he would bring them in and he would set both of them on my desk. And we would sit and talk and we would eat our sweet potatoes. And he would teach me Chinese words because he thought that was very important. And I thought, I love this man. He's wonderful. He's dispelled every myth I could have ever had. And it was so great. I learned a lot about him and what his life in China had been like before he came to the school. But he was a wonderful person to get to know and a real architect of business and architecture. He just had the IEs doing all the things they needed to do and the bus drivers. And when we went into SARS, he was spearheading everything to make sure everything was cleaned, cleaned the number of times that it needed to be done. He was just on top of everything all the time. That's great. Wonderful, wonderful person. Yeah, I love that. Okay, audience, so think about this the last time you felt completely out of place. Okay, audience, did it make you more judgmental or more compassionate? Listening to our guest today, Janet Flaherty, talk about her experience in China and mine, it makes you wanna think, ask that question to yourself. So sometimes discomfort isn't punishment, it's preparation, preparation for something wonderful. What Janet was just talking about, meeting somebody at their very best and being open enough to express and have a conversation and learn about them. Okay, so now that we got that out of the way, audience, when was the last time that you've been uncomfortable or you should have been a better person? When was the last time? Comment below. And as you're commenting, I'm gonna get to Janet and answer the third question. Okay, so I want you to look back now, Janet. What did living in China reveal about America that you couldn't have seen until you left it? Well, I think I knew this, but seeing it in reality, seeing it play out, we have an enormous ego in this country. We think we know everything, know how to do everything, do everything right. Nobody does it better than we do, no place is better than America, all those things. And I have to say, I'll be honest, there is no place better for me to live than in America. That's good. It does have everything. We have too much. Yeah, we have, right. We do, we do have too much, you're right. It's just true, but we have such big egos. And I'm definitely speaking for me, I know everybody doesn't, but I do. Right. And being exposed like that, when you are a guest, you are a newcomer, you look different than everybody else. Yes. And you can't talk, and having that out there, and then taking that step around your ego and saying, okay. Yeah. There are other ways to do these things. They may not be the way I knew them, but look here, they're working for 14 million people in Beijing, so people must be doing something right. That's correct. Being able to put yourself in that guest position. I'm pretty ignorant, I don't know necessarily how it should be done here, I wanna learn, I wanna get better at it, so I could function here as well as a partner, as well as people who live here. That was eye-opening for me, and a very positive experience. I think it's humbling to discover that, well, look here, the rest of the world just keeps going on and they're doing okay, and they're not you. Yeah, that's good, that's good. So who did you become, Janet, when you went to Beijing? Because I know it was uncomfortable, but who did you really become? Well, you ask hard questions, Edna. I think I became a better version of myself, a wiser person, and I don't think I wasn't an accepting person, but I think I became better at that, and better at trying to open myself up to other people so they would be accepting of me as well, because I think it works both ways. When you scratch the surface, we're all pretty much the same. We all want food on our table, clothes on our back, a place to shelter, safety, the best for our kids, our kids to have a better life than we have. We all want those things. I've never, ever, Edna, met a single adult who, if I said to them, what do you wanna be when you grow up? I have never heard anybody say to me, I wanna be a family member. Everybody wants to be a success. Everybody wants to do well, and it's incumbent on each of us, whoever we are, from whatever country we are, to reach out and take that risk, and hold a hand out to one another and say, let's get to know each other. Let's get to know each other better because we'll make the world a better place so that all of us can have those things, because all of our children should have better lives, and all people should have the opportunity to be successful. That's right. That's beautiful. So for me, it was a growthful experience. Yes, that's beautiful. Well, audience, the biggest transformation rarely happens because life gets easy, as you heard from our guest today. You gotta be willing to become someone new, and in that, if you get the two bottles of water, which is an expose of her life in China, you're gonna get more of that immigration newbie feeling, and you're gonna get to know some things about the transformation that she has experienced from the two bottles of water. Okay, so right now, guest Janet, it is our flash round where you will get, I will give you eight questions, and you gotta think fast and give me answers. Are you ready? I'm ready. Okay. Describe Beijing in one word. What's the biggest culture shock? Being in a, do I have to do that in one word? No. Okay. Being in a place where you can't communicate with people through the language. Good. Favorite Chinese tradition? Mooncakes. Ooh, I love them. Hardest lesson you learned? Hardest lesson? Okay, none of them were hard lessons, really. They were all helpful lessons. Okay, that's good. Okay, one stereotype you left behind? That all Chinese people are tiny. A habit Americans could learn from Chinese culture? I think, wait a second. Well, here's a funny one. Chinese people do not wait in line. And if you stand in line at a store, like customer service, they are gonna just go right in. What? And get in line ahead of you. That was a funny lesson. Wow. Oh, yes. That happened to me, you're right. It happened to me at KC, you're right. You're right. I forgot about that one. That was a good one. One place everyone should visit before they die? That's a tough one too? Tough one, because I can do them all. I think if you could go before you die to see the Great Wall of China, it doesn't have to be the fancy remodeled part, but even just one of the old parts that are out in the country, and you can climb the 20 feet to get up on top. Yeah. It is an incredible experience. That's great. That's really good. Finish this sentence. Home isn't a place, it's a? Home is a state of mind. It's where the family is. That's good. Where the people feel comfortable. That's good. Last words, Janet. Before we close, what's one message you hope every reader and every listener carries after speaking to you or reading your book? I think it would be that education separates us from the animal kingdom. I guess we're even part of it, but, and so make an effort to take a risk. It doesn't have to be a giant risk. You don't have to jump off the Empire State Building or anything, but you'll miss a little risk, a little opportunity to try something different, go somewhere different, talk to somebody different, step around your own ego, and find out about other people, because you'll discover that you love them because they're just the same as you. I would encourage people to do that. Take that opportunity. If your kids can go different places, go to camps or go to other countries or wherever it might be. Take those opportunities if you can, because it will help you as a person. It will help make you a better person. That's beautiful. Well, Janet, thank you for your wisdom, your honesty, and your willingness to share a journey that reminds us that growth often begins where comfort ends. Thank you for helping us see the world and ourselves with fresh eyes. Listen, audience, today's conversation made you think, challenged your assumptions, or inspired you to look at people differently. Please like this episode, subscribe so you never miss another powerful conversation, and most importantly, share this episode with someone who needs to hear it. If you're ready to stop standing still and start creating your next chapter with purpose, look under the video and you'll find your next move strategy. Your future doesn't change by accident. It changes by decision. Until next time, keep it real, keep it purposeful. Bye for now. Thank you.