Johan Westerholm: Islamismen är ingen ny företeelse i Europa

Johan Westerholm editor-in-chief at Ledarskiderna and writer for Epoch Times Welcome Thank you You've examined Islam and Islam in Europe more than almost anyone else You've also been remarkably early in warning about Islamism How long have these currents within Islam so to speak been known and were there other voices in Europe It depends more on the distance really so let's start with that The currents within Islam or the development within Islam With this form of Islamism one could say it's a type of fascism whether it has been layered on top of Islam or the other way around It begins to come alive in the 1930s with Haji al-Amin the Grand Mufti of Jerusalem It then evolves from being a social movement encompassing daycares senior homes and schools became anti-colonial movement with clear fascist elements Haji al-Amin who came from a youth who served as Grand Mufti of Jerusalem where this major migration took place He came from the Ottoman Turks He studied in Istanbul where he pursued his education He was born in Jerusalem while studying in Istanbul and was deeply influenced at an early age by the fascist movement known as the Ung Turks So one could say that marks a starting point Another starting point is Egypt and Algeria in the 1960s ere notably Sayyid Qutb now it gets quite a list of names here Sayyid Qutb Thus he would become the brotherhood's most important ideologue He wrote a book titled Social Justice in Islam and it was always intended to bring the Muslim brotherhood back to being a social movement It's simply about distribution policy and how to build welfare in a Muslim welfare state with funding from the virtuous citizens and the virtuous ummah that is the compilation Men since he was part of the Muslim Brotherhood which was already banned as an organization at the time and he became quite radicalized writing what he is perhaps best known for —a book titled Milestones Milestones was used as a manual for the same car bomb when he was building Al-Qaida Men around the same time a major shift occurs and within it an additional transformation takes place in the Muslim brotherhood and this is precisely where one can see today's Islamism taking root as the Egyptian regime expelled them in the 1960s Five hundred Egyptian teachers who happen to be members of the Brotherhood land in Algeria And in Algeria another thinker Frantz Fanon was active or rather his memory remains as he passed away in 1961 men his radical ideas about armed struggle against a white supremacy It is incredibly deeply rooted in Algeria And Frantz Fanon's book The Wretched of the Earth later came to be used as a handbook as the Black Power and Black Panther movements were being built up in the United States during the 1960s Yet here we see how today's Islamism a purified fascist totalitarian ideology is emerging It is being exported partly to the United States but especially to Munich e Muslim Islamic Center in Munich And there this ideational work was taken up by what later became the Muslim Brotherhood Islamic scholar Yusuf Al-Qaradawi And there it is in the 1970s so it boils down today's Muslim brotherhood with the establishment and transformation of the Western world to align with Islam And this ultimately leads to a power struggle between the Muslim brotherhood and another movement a major conference held in Birmingham in 1988 where people advocated that Islam should be adapted to fit Europe rather than the other way around This struggle has been going on for three years one could say between those who want an adaptation of Islam and those who don't They rise up and say "We surrender " It's you who have won the battle over where should Islam be in Europe What later became Euro-Islam And Euro-Islam today is essentially the same as the Muslim Brotherhood It is for the Western world to adapt to Islam not for Islam to adapt to the world's nations culture norms and legislation How is European culture and European faith viewed And how are other religions seen within this framework They must adapt That’s the classic approach umma not the umma but so this is the classic that one should adapt to Islam And this we see among other things a bit amusing for the one who steps into the archive so close so near Stockholm's Great Mosque the birch garden at Medborgarplatsen Stockholm's Mosque The initial building permit applications submitted at that time were for structures taller than Katarina Church But you couldn't get a building permit for that But that's just it According to the tradition no building is allowed to be lower than the local mosque but they were denied permission to build But it's quite fascinating for someone interested in architecture and the culture behind the earliest buildings He's really trying to build the tallest building on Södermalm What happens with this movement Who wouldn't want to see Islam in Europe more adapted to Europe's circumstances It's still present to such an extent that there clearly is room for it otherwise it is found in Denmark it is found in France it is found in Germany in measure and much in mosques then as There is no single Islam rather as it were there is a fragmentation into clans affiliations and individual families and how one interprets Islam and this falls within a concept known as Ichihan which means you should arrive at your own understanding of Islam and there it is this more secular or secularly adapted orientation it still exists there since they do allow it after all other female imams in Berlin Paris another French city but especially Copenhagen and them and why have they been able to emerge Well it' s because the state has been there in this case bejakat the type of development not necessarily with state funding but they have received political support from e majority society the secular majority society and therefore they have been able to continue existing and to some extent develop but one should know that this is a small minority yet the ideas remain and perhaps that's exactly what we should try to grasp from all of this You mean that this more secular Islam present in Europe is a minority compared to yes at the organizational level that's what it is but secular Muslims It is secular and therefore has a low level of organizational membership I think we've discussed this before but that's precisely what's happening here The great strength of Muslim brotherhood lies precisely in their high level of organizational structure and they are accustomed to it—they desire it organize themselves they want to come together— the more liberal the more secular you are the more you just want to live your life and the less are you willing to contribute to this kind of development that requires unity and demands commitme one could say that secularism in this case is both the greatest asset and the greatest threat to this kind of more tolerant society liberal orientation of Islam Timona Mohamsson received intense criticism when she spoke about a blue and yellow Islam existing here and being allowed to exist What support is needed The blue-yellow Islam does not exist in an organized form here is what I would suggest To do this is to carefully read the proceedings of the 1988 Birmingham conference and capture everything that was said there and then and who were the ones arguing for this Simona Mohamsson has often claimed not to be particularly credible and I give ot to mention this issue I don' t quite get the impression as an outsider that she fully grasps the complexity and challenges involved Of course those who prefer a more traditional interpretation of Islam naturally oppose this development men especially Islamist movements such as the Muslim Brotherhood stand today most of civil society the Muslim civil society what do you mean by that They don't want this— they don't want a secularized liberalized Islam What would you say this means for more secularized more secular Muslims in Sweden seeing it like this So it's extremely difficult I mean if we're talking about the state's support in the trust fund so two of the Muslim organizations are dominated by the Muslim Brotherhood and it is the group that organizes a total There are at least a hundred thousand Muslims in Sweden at any rate and the other one is obviously the Shia Foundation which is entirely controlled by theocratic junta in Tehran so it's extremely difficult there's simply no other there's no Muslim faith foundation that runs these more secular Okay so if this if organizations didn't exist at all what should one then do to achieve a more Islam interpretable The thoughts and ideas have always existed—how can we return to them in Europe and Sweden We begin in Sweden at the micro level as the government has had these new democratic criteria in place for a year now so they apply to Leverage government grants— those are precisely designed to make you say yes to what must be done this trust fund here promoting equality and non -discrimination everything we associate with Sweden yet these democratic criteria They go a step further by requiring those who receive state funding to demonstrate that they impose the same standards on their partner organizations at is to say and here it is actually so that the government and the state 's support for Rohansso It has a regulatory framework so just start implementing it and then the state subsidy is provided in the form of kronor and Aaron but there is indeed a government grant that is not paid out in cash kronor and Aaron but rather as a service provided by the state and it's the tax burden and I suppose I could imagine that if a pension fund shows they aren't living up to the democratic criteria first and foremost the subsidies must be withdrawn but one must not forget to remove the support one already has for their tax obligations for this support it is incredibly valuable for these congregations so they don’t have to send out payment slips as it’s automatically included income tax the municipal and state portions come it's the Tax Agency that handles this collection and if one loses it then these congregations and organizations step in dying and dead very quickly very rapidly So it's a tool we have which I think the government does have The country has successfully met these democratic criteria and if so then those standards must also be applied— otherwise it's nothing but a paper tiger Imam Ali Center Järfälla is a Shia Muslim institution run from Tehran unlike the Stockholm mosque you'referring to Are there any Muslim religious communities in Sweden that don't hold these more extreme interpretations At the national level I would say no there isn't But at the local level local mosques—there you will find it dividual imams congregations that have a more liberal secularized Western left-leaning application They say they are a minority and are constantly exposed to attacks How could the state possibly intervene to support these communities By openly backing them—this can be achieved through words You can do a lot with study visits you can bring the press along you can achieve a great deal with small budgets which send psychologically significant signaler One does not need to follow the prime minister's lead inviting Muslim Red Crescent and Shia communities to negotiations the royal palace What he has done Yet on the other hand the prime minister Stefan Löfven also made it enticing Choose which ones from the political side you decide to support and stand behind There's just one Google Doc or now I can send the link to both Urs Kristersson and Magdalena Andersson so it can also be accessed by both of them email Johan Westerholm Why do we have this blindness in Sweden I'd like to say that it goes back quite a long way— if I were to take the religious perspective Sweden never became a colonial power and that is exactly what we wanted to be as well We tried at least Gustav III tried Instead of conquering land the missionary movement ended up gaining enormous momentum The sensation Oh well then Sweden said then we shall win If we cannot win their land we shall win their souls We sent Swedish free churches especially the Missionary Union which sent missionaries o every corner of the world Missionaries in Africa extremely common In China extremely common So I think it's somewhat of an apologetic inferiority complex that we want to be Definitely a sense of inferiority complex In what way An apologetic inferiority complex We want to be good or Sweden will at least show itself skilled at something And then we can be skilled at being Apologize and allow the best to happen